Comments on: The MRF’s New Theory http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/ Resources for Morgellons investigators. Skeptical analysis and discussion. Sat, 21 Feb 2009 17:10:26 -0800 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Niecy http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-18001 Niecy Sun, 06 Jan 2008 22:03:02 +0000 http://208.109.216.142/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/#comment-18001 Jelly Babies, I don't know if this matters, but a few years(3 or 4)back my husband and I went as chaperones on a school trip with the JrROTC and we stayed on the premises at a pretty shabby facility at Maxwell AFB. We toured every public aspect of the base. I am having MAJOR problems with my eyes and I am BLIND in one from a childhood accident. I was sent to a specialist because my optomotrist was VERY concerned about the stuff growing in my eyes. The specialist she sent me to, she wanted me there that day, but it was the following day before I could go, said it was a simple case of Penguicula. I have always thought if Penguicula is so common, then why did my local opt. send me to a specialist? He also said it WOULD NOT cause any vision problems, that it was just cosmetic. I am having serious VISION problems. We also spent the day at another AFB in Alabama on that trip, I will have to find out the name of it. Also, my brother was in the Air Force and stationed at Keesler, in Biloxi. I also used to date,a long time ago, a man that was in the Reserve, that went to Keesler once a year, but mainly Camp Shelby in Hattiesburg, MS. Also, my brother went to Biloxi and worked for close to a year after Katrina hit, he had sores on him when he came home and he stayed with my family for several months. I don't put alot into that because he is a drug user, but he has been incarcerated for over a year and still has the sores. I started having lesions in August of 2005, they started on my back, the vision problems started about a year ago. One more thing, I was in Florida in Feb. after Katrina hit, then again in April. I have relatives that visit from Biloxi, and from Mobile. If you have any info that could enlighten me, or my doctor, please, please send it to me @ v.mattie2@gmail.com. I would be very greatful! I have been in contact with several military personnel that were in the Gulf War. I have been talking to and taking samples to a parasitologist at a nearby university. He said that there was stuff, like leishmaniasis, coming back with our soldiers, that particular infection fits my symptoms, exactly, but I can't be tested for it because I have not been out of the country. I read somewhere, I'm sure I saved it, that a dermatologist in North Texas had at least 9 confirmed cases of Leishmanisis from people that have NEVER left this country!!!! You are so right!!! Tell me how to help and I will!!!! The parasitologist also thinks that I had horsehair worms in many of my sores. He was flabergasted, and said it wasn't supposed to be, but he was positive it was. He also found other things, but he always said it was nothing definitive. I took him a BLACK FLY that I got out of my bathroom, and HE HAD NEVER SEEN ONE LIKE IT!!!! He had been communicating with me on a nearly daily basis, and all of a sudden he backed way off!! My friend, not knowing that I didn't want her to tell him, told my md who the Parasitologist was and what university that he worked for. I am nearly positive that my doc contacted him and ask him not to make my DELUSIONAL problem any worse. I know that he was helping me on his own time, and may not have gotten permission from the administration to be analyzing my samples. But I will tell you this, he said I DEFINITLY had something going on, and that it was MULTIPLE, and he had not seen alot of the things that I brought in and they were the most intriguing samples he had ever seen, then BOOM, no more contact.!!! Jelly Babies, I don’t know if this matters, but a few years(3 or 4)back my husband and I went as chaperones on a school trip with the JrROTC and we stayed on the premises at a pretty shabby facility at Maxwell AFB. We toured every public aspect of the base. I am having MAJOR problems with my eyes and I am BLIND in one from a childhood accident. I was sent to a specialist because my optomotrist was VERY concerned about the stuff growing in my eyes. The specialist she sent me to, she wanted me there that day, but it was the following day before I could go, said it was a simple case of Penguicula. I have always thought if Penguicula is so common, then why did my local opt. send me to a specialist? He also said it WOULD NOT cause any vision problems, that it was just cosmetic. I am having serious VISION problems. We also spent the day at another AFB in Alabama on that trip, I will have to find out the name of it. Also, my brother was in the Air Force and stationed at Keesler, in Biloxi. I also used to date,a long time ago, a man that was in the Reserve, that went to Keesler once a year, but mainly Camp Shelby in Hattiesburg, MS. Also, my brother went to Biloxi and worked for close to a year after Katrina hit, he had sores on him when he came home and he stayed with my family for several months. I don’t put alot into that because he is a drug user, but he has been incarcerated for over a year and still has the sores. I started having lesions in August of 2005, they started on my back, the vision problems started about a year ago. One more thing, I was in Florida in Feb. after Katrina hit, then again in April. I have relatives that visit from Biloxi, and from Mobile. If you have any info that could enlighten me, or my doctor, please, please send it to me @ v.mattie2@gmail.com. I would be very greatful! I have been in contact with several military personnel that were in the Gulf War. I have been talking to and taking samples to a parasitologist at a nearby university. He said that there was stuff, like leishmaniasis, coming back with our soldiers, that particular infection fits my symptoms, exactly, but I can’t be tested for it because I have not been out of the country. I read somewhere, I’m sure I saved it, that a dermatologist in North Texas had at least 9 confirmed cases of Leishmanisis from people that have NEVER left this country!!!! You are so right!!! Tell me how to help and I will!!!! The parasitologist also thinks that I had horsehair worms in many of my sores. He was flabergasted, and said it wasn’t supposed to be, but he was positive it was. He also found other things, but he always said it was nothing definitive. I took him a BLACK FLY that I got out of my bathroom, and HE HAD NEVER SEEN ONE LIKE IT!!!! He had been communicating with me on a nearly daily basis, and all of a sudden he backed way off!! My friend, not knowing that I didn’t want her to tell him, told my md who the Parasitologist was and what university that he worked for. I am nearly positive that my doc contacted him and ask him not to make my DELUSIONAL problem any worse. I know that he was helping me on his own time, and may not have gotten permission from the administration to be analyzing my samples. But I will tell you this, he said I DEFINITLY had something going on, and that it was MULTIPLE, and he had not seen alot of the things that I brought in and they were the most intriguing samples he had ever seen, then BOOM, no more contact.!!!

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By: Jelly Babies http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-16848 Jelly Babies Fri, 07 Dec 2007 15:47:40 +0000 http://208.109.216.142/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/#comment-16848 There is something about Onchocerca volvulus that the powers that be are desperate for us not to find out about. I don't know that it is involved in Morgellons but other filarial parasites that were also imported into the New World with slavery, such as Mansonella perstans, might be. They warrant careful investigation. The following is a message sent to an American doctor submitting testimony to a DoVA subcommittee investigating Gulf War syndrome. The links leave no doubt that the involvement of onchocerciasis has been concealed. **************************************************************** Would you please consider raising the issue of the absence of screening for onchocerciasis with the DoVA? I have managed to get a diagnosis and treatment in London, UK, but my American colleagues' reasonable requests for diagnostic investigations are being ignored. In 1980, onchocerciasis was reported by the ophthalmologist, probably an American, from the hospital on the Khamis Mushayt airbase where Stealth bombers were stationed during the 1991 Gulf War. (scroll down to letter #7 at the following link) http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/eletters/329/7472/940-b#81939 Most residents of regions endemic for filarial infections have been exposed, at least to some small extent. Michael A Forgione, is Chief of Infectious Diseases at the hospital on the Keesler Air Force Base at Biloxi in Mississippi. http://www.keesler.af.mil/ He co-authored a paper describing onchocerciasis as an infection affecting "multiple organ systems" which is much the same as describing it as a "multisymptom illness". http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic1667.htm "Background: Onchocerciasis is a chronic parasitic disease caused by the filarial nematode Onchocerca volvulus. Infection affects multiple organ systems . . . . . . . ." Coauthor(s): Robert A Schwartz, MD, MPH, Professor and Head of Dermatology, Professor of Medicine, Professor of Pediatrics, Professor of Pathology, Professor of Preventive Medicine and Community Health, UMDNJ-New Jersey Medical School; Rajendra Kapila, MD, MBBS, Associate Professor, Department of Medicine, UMDNJ, New Jersey Medical School; Michael A Forgione, Jr, MD, Chief of Infectious Diseases, Instructor, Department of Medicine, Keesler Medical Center The Air Force Logistics Management Agency (AFMLA) is a USAF management think tank based at Maxwell AFB in Alabama. They report directly to the head of Air Force logistics in the Pentagon. http://www.aflma.hq.af.mil/ According to AFMLA, military health risk assessors identified onchocerciasis as an endemic health risk prior to the deployment of troops to Arabia in 1990. This prediction led, in part, to the acknowledged overuse of pesticides during the conflict. http://www.aflma.hq.af.mil/lgj/vol22_no2.pdf (scroll down to the bottom of page 19 of the pdf to find) "Personnel were also exposed to the effects of the desert environment. Health hazards associated with the desert environment vary. Hazards which particularly worried military health officials were onchocerciasis ("river blindness"), bilharzias (schistosomiasis), malaria and strangely enough, rabies. River blindness was common in this theater and is caused when an individual is bitten by the black fly—an insect smaller than a common housefly that injects its larva into the bloodstream . . . . . . . ." It therefore follows that the US military predicted that onchocerciasis, presenting as multisymptom illness, would become symptomatic in large numbers of deployed personnel at any time following the required 18+ months incubation period. This is exactly what happened. Consequently, it is surprising that CDC commissioned Fukuda and co- workers to investigate a "mystery illness" that some claimed was afflicting Gulf War veterans, although it was already known that the likely cause was onchocerciasis. Nevertheless, Fukuda and co-workers failed to investigate a single veteran for onchocerciasis, that they described as a "multisymptom illness" in the US Air Force veterans they investigated. http://jama.highwire.org/cgi/content/abstract/280/11/981 Fukuda K, Nisenbaum R, Stewart G, Thompson WW, Robin L, Washko RM, et al. Chronic multisymptom illness affecting Air Force veterans of the Gulf War. Journal of the American Medical Association 1998;280:981–8. That the involvement of onchocerciasis in GWS has been ignored, or even concealed, is not in question. The question is why? I submit that it is reasonable for Americans to demand that both the USAF and CDC account for themselves. Please bring this problem to the attention of Congress. Yours faithfully There is something about Onchocerca volvulus that the powers that be are desperate for us not to find out about. I don’t know that it is involved in Morgellons but other filarial parasites that were also imported into the New World with slavery, such as Mansonella perstans, might be. They warrant careful investigation.

The following is a message sent to an American doctor submitting testimony to a DoVA subcommittee investigating Gulf War syndrome. The links leave no doubt that the involvement of onchocerciasis has been concealed.

****************************************************************

Would you please consider raising the issue of the absence of
screening for onchocerciasis with the DoVA? I have managed to get a
diagnosis and treatment in London, UK, but my American colleagues’
reasonable requests for diagnostic investigations are being ignored.

In 1980, onchocerciasis was reported by the ophthalmologist, probably
an American, from the hospital on the Khamis Mushayt airbase where
Stealth bombers were stationed during the 1991 Gulf War.
(scroll down to letter #7 at the following link)
http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/eletters/329/7472/940-b#81939

Most residents of regions endemic for filarial infections have been
exposed, at least to some small extent.

Michael A Forgione, is Chief of Infectious Diseases at the hospital
on the Keesler Air Force Base at Biloxi in Mississippi.
http://www.keesler.af.mil/

He co-authored a paper describing onchocerciasis as an infection
affecting “multiple organ systems” which is much the same as
describing it as a “multisymptom illness”.
http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic1667.htm

“Background: Onchocerciasis is a chronic parasitic disease caused by
the filarial nematode Onchocerca volvulus. Infection affects multiple
organ systems . . . . . . . .”
Coauthor(s): Robert A Schwartz, MD, MPH, Professor and Head of
Dermatology, Professor of Medicine, Professor of Pediatrics,
Professor of Pathology, Professor of Preventive Medicine and
Community Health, UMDNJ-New Jersey Medical School;
Rajendra Kapila, MD, MBBS, Associate Professor, Department of
Medicine, UMDNJ, New Jersey Medical School;
Michael A Forgione, Jr, MD, Chief of Infectious Diseases, Instructor,
Department of Medicine, Keesler Medical Center

The Air Force Logistics Management Agency (AFMLA) is a USAF
management think tank based at Maxwell AFB in Alabama. They report
directly to the head of Air Force logistics in the Pentagon.
http://www.aflma.hq.af.mil/

According to AFMLA, military health risk assessors identified
onchocerciasis as an endemic health risk prior to the deployment of
troops to Arabia in 1990. This prediction led, in part, to the
acknowledged overuse of pesticides during the conflict.
http://www.aflma.hq.af.mil/lgj/vol22_no2.pdf
(scroll down to the bottom of page 19 of the pdf to find)
“Personnel were also exposed to the effects of the desert
environment. Health hazards associated with the desert environment
vary. Hazards which particularly worried military health officials
were onchocerciasis (”river blindness”), bilharzias
(schistosomiasis), malaria and strangely enough, rabies. River
blindness was common in this theater and is caused when an individual
is bitten by the black fly—an insect smaller than a common housefly
that injects its larva into the bloodstream . . . . . . . .”

It therefore follows that the US military predicted that
onchocerciasis, presenting as multisymptom illness, would become
symptomatic in large numbers of deployed personnel at any time
following the required 18+ months incubation period. This is exactly
what happened.

Consequently, it is surprising that CDC commissioned Fukuda and co-
workers to investigate a “mystery illness” that some claimed was
afflicting Gulf War veterans, although it was already known that the
likely cause was onchocerciasis. Nevertheless, Fukuda and co-workers
failed to investigate a single veteran for onchocerciasis, that they
described as a “multisymptom illness” in the US Air Force veterans
they investigated.
http://jama.highwire.org/cgi/content/abstract/280/11/981
Fukuda K, Nisenbaum R, Stewart G, Thompson WW, Robin L, Washko RM, et
al. Chronic multisymptom illness affecting Air Force veterans of the
Gulf War. Journal of the American Medical Association 1998;280:981–8.

That the involvement of onchocerciasis in GWS has been ignored, or
even concealed, is not in question. The question is why? I submit
that it is reasonable for Americans to demand that both the USAF and
CDC account for themselves.

Please bring this problem to the attention of Congress.

Yours faithfully

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By: STARLINK http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-13843 STARLINK Wed, 17 Oct 2007 06:43:23 +0000 http://208.109.216.142/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/#comment-13843 Marg- no one really cares about your professional jargon. We all have them so mathmatical jargon doesnt impress many Marg-

no one really cares about your professional jargon. We all have them so mathmatical jargon doesnt impress many

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By: STARLINK http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-13842 STARLINK Wed, 17 Oct 2007 06:34:38 +0000 http://208.109.216.142/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/#comment-13842 mathematical language, wtf is that? How about ENGLISH??? mathematical language, wtf is that? How about ENGLISH???

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By: Michael http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-13827 Michael Tue, 16 Oct 2007 15:45:36 +0000 http://208.109.216.142/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/#comment-13827 I was using mathematical language, since it's a bit more international. The point being that the "case definition" is poorly defined, and encompasses a large number of current conditions. Like a Venn diagram - normally it's the <i>intersection</i> of various symptoms that defines a condition, but in the case of Morgellons, it's the <i>union</i> - which gives you a huge potential population, and is not really a disease. I was using mathematical language, since it’s a bit more international. The point being that the “case definition” is poorly defined, and encompasses a large number of current conditions.

Like a Venn diagram – normally it’s the intersection of various symptoms that defines a condition, but in the case of Morgellons, it’s the union – which gives you a huge potential population, and is not really a disease.

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By: Smileykins http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-13818 Smileykins Tue, 16 Oct 2007 05:34:48 +0000 http://208.109.216.142/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/#comment-13818 Oh, Norman. Norman, I miss your comments so much, I can barely stand it sometimes. How're y'all doin'? Oh, Norman. Norman, I miss your comments so much, I can barely stand it sometimes. How’re y’all doin’?

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By: Starlink http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-13817 Starlink Tue, 16 Oct 2007 05:26:41 +0000 http://208.109.216.142/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/#comment-13817 Michael suddenly feels a fu fuzzy isosuface slice through the N-space of symptomatology. An artificial construct. But it’s one that a particular group of people gravitate to. A strange attractor for the chaotic mind. Michael suddenly feels a fu fuzzy isosuface slice through the N-space of symptomatology. An artificial construct.

But it’s one that a particular group of people gravitate to. A strange attractor for the chaotic mind.

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By: Michael http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-13815 Michael Tue, 16 Oct 2007 04:04:36 +0000 http://208.109.216.142/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/#comment-13815 Morgellons is a vague list of symptoms. A fuzzy isosuface slice through the N-space of symptomatology. An artificial construct. But it's one that a particular group of people gravitate to. A strange attractor for the chaotic mind. Morgellons is a vague list of symptoms. A fuzzy isosuface slice through the N-space of symptomatology. An artificial construct.

But it’s one that a particular group of people gravitate to. A strange attractor for the chaotic mind.

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By: dant-ua http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-13808 dant-ua Tue, 16 Oct 2007 00:16:24 +0000 http://208.109.216.142/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/#comment-13808 Oh... and one more thing... You see Morgellons or CFS or VSD is not a static process. This is very dynamic process with...well i really don't know how to say.... Like a huge system of equations with "n" unknown quantity and a lot of parameters, where n+1t determinant is time. So the disease must be considered as dynamic process. I think only at the end phase it could considered as the static process. By the way the main cause of misdiagnosis is slow dynamics of some diseases(and faraway end static phase). Oh… and one more thing… You see Morgellons or CFS or VSD is not a static process. This is very dynamic process with…well i really don’t know how to say…. Like a huge system of equations with “n” unknown quantity and a lot of parameters, where n+1t determinant is time.

So the disease must be considered as dynamic process. I think only at the end phase it could considered as the static process. By the way the main cause of misdiagnosis is slow dynamics of some diseases(and faraway end static phase).

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By: dant-ua http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/comment-page-1/#comment-13807 dant-ua Mon, 15 Oct 2007 23:51:44 +0000 http://208.109.216.142/2007/09/11/the-mrfs-new-theory/#comment-13807 >How do you define the patient population? With the fully anamnesis research, symptom and clinical verifications(Believe me, very detailed research and verification). >Does every who SAYS they have Morgellons have it? What the if criteria for someone >to actually have Morgellons. There are no any Morgellons in Ukraine or Russia. Here this list of symptoms have some other names like CFS, VSD and other. The name doesn't matter. If you are interested i can give you some links to russian-speaking community. >How do you define the patient population?

With the fully anamnesis research, symptom and clinical verifications(Believe me, very detailed research and verification).

>Does every who SAYS they have Morgellons have it? What the if criteria for someone
>to actually have Morgellons.

There are no any Morgellons in Ukraine or Russia. Here this list of symptoms have some other names like CFS, VSD and other.

The name doesn’t matter.

If you are interested i can give you some links to russian-speaking community.

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