In his article “A cure for Morgellons disease?”, Dr Chris Rangel says something that Morgellons believers will like:

“these patients are neither crazy nor are they faking their symptoms “

I agree, at least with the point he is making. Here’s the full article:

Here is the article in the NY Times:

And here’s the actual study under discussion:

And the “cure” (Cognitive-Behavioral Therapy for Somatization Disorder) 

Is this a “cure for Morgellons”? No, it’s an effective treatment for Somatization Disorder.  That might cover a lot of the cases of Morgellons, but it’s not going to treat those who have genuine dermatological and neurological disorder, and simply mistakenly believe they have Morgellons, since they find some fibers on their skin.  It might help them seek more effective treatments, however.

344 Responses to “Morgellons Cure?”

  1. What these articles do not explain is How I can pinpoint the time, the place and the likely vector concerning when all these symptoms began. No history of any type of mental disorder, college graduate, successful career and credible witness. (I have never been sick other than the common cold, am very active, and cant stand the thought of being ill or god forbid dependant on anyone).

    so your articles linked are a not applicable to those who are unfortunate enough to also have what I have, and I personally do not want it, at all and would have never even thought for a second about something like this ever happening to me. Until it did.

    These articles do not explain how practicing physicians who are infected, nor a researcher who is also a University professor of medicine/biology State Clearly that there is a physical disorder here. No Question. So again, I ask what it is that you stand to gain from your repeated position that this is a mental disorder? From my perspective there are two outcomes to this problem as related to you. A.) You get to gloat and say I told you so(extremely unlikely) B.) You eat crow and simply disappear to not be heard from again (HIGHLY LIKELY)

    So again, what do you stand to gain from your position?

  2. Wymore’s research to me has already diapproved his own theory. The fibers didnt match up to each other chemically and were not organic (aka alive). Which dismisses most of the stories of these fibers being alive(especailly wacko dr. “ones burrowing into my eyeball” smith). Michael is not on here to gloat, he, like myself is interested in science. I also think that like myself, he wants to make people aware that no reasonable scientific studies hav ever been proven to exist, and that just because something gets a lot of media attention that it doesnt exist either. And these mental disorders are very common and can be treated. Nother has been done scientifically to prove this exists, and what has been done has not proved anything other than pointing out this disease may not exist.

    What is your history south city. Have you been treated for any mental health issues while have thing condition. Have you even tried to be treated?

  3. South, I don’t stand to gain anything, except perhaps a little satisfaction from helping people get the medical care that is right for them as individuals.

    My position is NOT that “this is a mental disorder”. My position is clearly stated at the top of the left column on every page on this site, under “The evidence indicates:”

    1. The fibers are environmental and unrelated to any illness
    2. Morgellons is not a distinct disease
    3. “Sufferers” have a mixed variety of physical and/or mental illnesses.

  4. South,

    I thought you said that the pathogens that had been making you sick had become dormant. Have I misunderstood, or are you in remission? What are your symptoms at the present time?

    Tall Cotton

  5. People who “simply mistakenly believe they have Morgellons, since they find some fibers on their skin” are DOP if they can’t be shaken from that belief. The belief is unfounded and totally illogical. The sooner thes people accept that fact, the sooner they can be on the road to restored health.

  6. I have seen very few Morgies that are simply hypochondriacs. A visit to biology online will, however, reveal a number people that are both DOP and schizophrenic. You can’t show me a Morgie, anywhere, that isn’t suffering from one or more mental disorders. It just doesn’t happen that way.

  7. Tall, I think you are looking at a bit of a skewed sample. LB&BO get the more “imaginative” people.

  8. I’ve visited other Morgellons believer’s websites besides Lymebusters and BiologyOnline. I sure don’t know where you found people that are mentally stable. Granted, I shouldn’t have used the term, “anywhere”, because I havn’t been everywhere, but I’ve been around. Until I see otherwise, that’s my story, and I’m sticking to it.

  9. I said I wouldn’t come back here, but I feel that a statement made above deserves correction. Dr Wymore has never felt that the fibers are alive, as I’ve said before there is no cell stucture, not to mention melting/boiling points that could not possibly be organic. I’m not sure where the people on this blog got the idea that our research indicates that the fibers are alive in any way. I believe we must have gotten confused with some other entity or group. Dr Wymore is keeping a completely open mind as to the possible causes for morgellons. I’ve even asked him what he feels is the most likely scenario and he believes that for us to focus on one possible cause at this point will keep us from finding what it truly is (or isn’t- we know there is a possibility this isn’t a true disease, but we still feel that it is) So, please, when you make statements concerning our livelyhood, make sure they’re accurate. We do this for a living, not recreation and I will (if no one minds) make occasional corrections to statements that directly concern my job.

  10. Oh,didn’t Wymore adamantly declare that the fibers are NOT industrial in origin. What does that leave other than organic? Organic, you said, basically means, “alive”. Of course, I know that that isn’t the exact definition. So, what’s left besides organic, and industrial fibers.

  11. Jace, what is Professor Wymore investigating?

  12. Oh, well, Jace, are the patients that this all started out with, who do think that the fibers are alive, and that they’re infested with them, and that they have something that they need to kill, and that there is an illusive pathogen that has caused all of their ailments…the ones listed in the case definition…just abandoned now, and the “newer people” who only think it’s abnormal to have any type of fiber, in, or on, their skin are the only people Dr. Wymore is now concerned with, in other words?

  13. A Mystery Ailment Gets Under Skin
    Chicago Tribune July 25, 2006

    “When dermatologists say these patients are either intentionally scratching themselves or it’s just fuzz from their clothing, well, there’s no way that would be visible under unbroken skin,” Wymore said. “Do I have any clue what’s actually going on here? Absolutely none. But there’s no question about the fibers: They are not just environmental contaminants.”

    Copyright © 2006, Chicago Tribune

  14. In my opinion, those fibers Wymore tested, were, in fact, environmental contamination. The fact that they did not burn at 760C indicates that they were not organic. The high melting point could indicate that they are fiberglass, ceramic, carbon fibers, or slightly modified rock wool. That doesn’t necessarily mean, however, that everyone exhibiting fibers in their lesions have this same type of fiber. But these, so far, appear to be heat-resistant industrial fibers.

  15. By environmental contaminants he means fibers that would be found normally in our environment- including industrial fibers (carpet, cotton, thread, etc). Industrial fibers would show up on the mass spec and gas chromatography and those types of fibers are definitely not shown on the databases we’ve looked at. We simply don’t know what the fibers are composed of. It could potentially be something new (or at the very least undiscovered), because the basic “environmental” fibers have been ruled out by testing. Even though we don’t know what the fibers are, I think saying they have to be either organic or industrial is ignoring the fact that it could be something new, or something that has been altered within the body. Right now we are still culturing from patient samples, but nothing definitive has shown up (other than normal skin contaminants) Once we’re allowed to do human studies I think it’ll be much easier to determine whether there is a novel process going on. I’ve been thinking alot about all this lately (yep, Michael, I’m open to many suggestions, and am constantly brainstorming what else could be the cause and how we can help). So to answer your questions as for what we’re doing now- we’re doing epidemiological studies and culturing patient submitted fibers. The ones you’ve seen on the shows were extracted from under the patients skin. I was present on these occasions and saw it with my own eyes- these are the ones we’re testing. Dr Wymore and I got lint samples from our own houses and yes, the majority of it is red and blue (which surprised both Dr Wymore and myself), but I have taken that lint and it disintegrates immediately in a butane flame. In my humble opinion this lint is not what patients are finding in their lesions, because the “fibers” aren’t even being changed at those high temps. And Smiley, unfortunately I don’t know what to say to your comment- your point is valid, and one that I struggle with daily. Since we do believe some sort of neurotoxin is causing the mental issues with these patients, combined with the fact that some of them are not sleeping for days at a time- their belief that the fibers are alive could come from either sleep deprivation, or neurotoxins. It’s really very sad. Can you imagine not sleeping for days? I spend a lot of my time talking to patients and their stories are all very similar. I try to find a common denominator between them. I tell them to keep all doctor’s appointments, and to follow all treatments. There are many who have told me they HAVE tried the antipsychotics and it does no good. Not all of the people who believe they have this are ignoring their doctor’s advice- a lot of them are following exactly what their doctors prescribe and still get no relief. This must mean something. But what? I really wish we knew.

  16. Jace must have left, for the time being.

    She said,

    I believe we must have gotten confused with some other entity or group.

    But no, Jace, I’m referring to the people that are registered at MRF, (and I suppose the NMO, now, too), that are described in the following link:

    Dr. Rangel’s view, (which I don’t disagree with), may cover some people who think they have “morgellons disease”, in which he quotes from Ginger Savely & Mary Leitao’s paper:

    The vast majority of patients with this disease have been diagnosed with a psychosomatic illness. Typically, patients have sought help from between ten and forty physicians and report that their symptoms are not taken seriously.

    But, Dr. Rangel stopped short, leaving out this part which immediately follows those two sentences:

    Patients report that physicians do not even do a thorough exam but make an instant diagnosis of DOP, and attribute the obvious open sores on patients’ skin as attempts at self-mutilation. One patient described his experience with this disease in this way: “I have had this disease for twenty years. I spent the first ten years going from doctor to doctor for help. I spent the last ten years just living with it, knowing that no one would ever help me.”

    The largest portion of “morgellons” patients that I’m familiar with, here, over the internet, swapping their daily stories of being infested with fibers and things that cause them to be driven into thinking they have to inflict harm to themselves, trying to kill them, as well as burning clothes, furniture, and various other horrifying things, and moving from place to place, trying to escape it…

    “…we must have gotten confused with some other entity or group”?

    So, these aren’t the people Dr. Wymore is referring to on OSU’s website, reiterating, there…

    *Donate money, time and services to the effort to find a cause and a cure

    *It will be cured when enough research is done to find its cause.

    What is he doing, Jace, and why is he doing it?

  17. Pardon me, Jace. I see you’ve returned.

  18. I don’t want to start arguments, but I do want to point out that “fiberglass, ceramic, carbon fibers, or slightly modified rock wool” would show up on the testing that has already be done. The fibers in question are not any of those.

  19. Smiley- I just took a long time to think out that last post so I didn’t make any errors. What I meant is from what I’ve been reading on this site, many people here believe that Dr Wymore and our lab has said these fibers are alive. We have never made that claim. I don’t know what “entity” it is that said that, but it was not us. That’s all I was referring to in that sentence, sorry for any confusion.

  20. I’m not trying to argue. I just call things like I see them. I was right about Mary Leitao, lonmg before anything came to light on her. I don’t like vulnerable people being taken for a ride that leads nowhere. That’s all, Jace. If he needed a grad study project, then fine, he chose a doozey.

  21. Can you imagine not sleeping for days?

    I attended every single day of the US Festival. I can completely relate to sleep deprivation. A few hundred thousand people thought Steve Wozniack was a god, back then.

  22. Jace, Dr Schwartz has recently claimed to have “identified the parasite” that causes Morgellons. That’s probably the source of the confusion.

  23. I know you’re not trying to argue. I really appreciate your insight as I’ve been reading through past blogs. Dr Wymore did not start this as a “grad project”- when he first started looking into it he didn’t have any grad students. I don’t like vulnerable people being taken for a ride either, and the snake oil people etc, REALLY bother me. And, just so you know- I’m not doing my graduate project with Wymore, this is something that can not possibly be completed in the 1.5 years I have left. I want you to know that I respect your, Michael, and tall cotton’s (when he’s not being mean to me) ideas. You have questions that need to be asked and answered- so do we, and I believe they are pretty much the same questions for us all.

  24. Jeeze- I’m asking this in all honesty- what happened to you after not sleeping for days? The psychological effects from that must have been pretty extreme. I truly can’t even imagine.

  25. Wymore said…
    “They are not just environmental contaminants.”

    Jace said…
    “By environmental contaminants he means fibers that would be found normally in our environment- including industrial fibers (carpet, cotton, thread, etc).”

    Is it true that organic materials cannot survive the temperature these fibers were exposed to, and remain intact?

    If the answer to that question is yes, wouldn’t that mean that the contamination would have to be environmental?

    The fibers may not be fiberglass, carbon, ceramic, or modified rock wool, but those are some examples that can survive these extreme temperatures, although organic materials cannot.

    Why not take a sample of the liquid that oozes from the lesions and see if this material fireproofs cotton? Why not coat some fiberglass fibers with the substance and see if it alters the signature of the gas chromatograph?

  26. Yeah, I can imagine that too, Jace. I don’t sleep for 3-5 days & nights in a row, pretty often, due to a physical disability. But anyway, you said:

    There are many who have told me they HAVE tried the antipsychotics and it does no good. Not all of the people who believe they have this are ignoring their doctor’s advice- a lot of them are following exactly what their doctors prescribe and still get no relief. This must mean something. But what? I really wish we knew.

    Dr. Wymore even put that into his letter to physicians. So, where did he get that? He didn’t carelessly just take patients’ word on that, same as you, did he? Nah, ya’ll wouldn’t do such a thing as that. You’re really trying to help this set of people, so we all know that you’ve interviewed them thoroughly, first and foremost, and collected all their medical records to see their prescriptions and referrals, and all of their doctors’ notes. Right? You wouldn’t dare claim to be trying to help them by not doing that, and just go launching off into some weird lab search with fibers that can go on indefinitely. Correct?

  27. Jace, well, I didn’t get so delusional that I thought Van Halen’s show was good that last night ;)

    I wasn’t taking any stimulants, so I confess to catnapping during the event. But you do get so tired that you are very prone to ‘seeing’ what the people around you claim to ‘see’. Also, a bit of paranoia and ‘seeing’ movement in peripheral vision.

    I had the added benefits of being in a very large crowd in very hot weather (dehydration). In stressful situations – and even though this was a major concert event that everyone actually WANTED to attend, it was stressful – large groups of people tend to take on a mind of their own. When someone said that some shady government agency had contaminated the water cannons with some unknown substance that was going to do some unknown thing to everyone it touched, within minutes that was common knowledge and accepted as fact. So a huge crowd of very hot, dehydrated people did the most illogical thing, and moved AWAY from the water cannons that were intended to provide relief from the heat.

    Sleep deprivation has been well studied, and is known to cause delusions and hallucinations. Sleep deprivation + group hysteria, I don’t know of any research on those conditions, but I am sure it must exist.


  28. Jace, I actually think Morgellons is more likely a demonstration of the “groupthink” phenomenon.

    “Groupthink is a mode of thought whereby individuals intentionally conform to what they perceive to be the consensus of the group. Groupthink may cause the group (typically a committee or large organization) to make bad or irrational decisions which each member might individually consider to be unwise.”

    Like, maybe, bathing in Lysol?

    The Wiki:

  29. Jace, also..

    Since we do believe some sort of neurotoxin is causing the mental issues with these patients, combined with the fact that some of them are not sleeping for days at a time- their belief that the fibers are alive could come from either sleep deprivation, or neurotoxins.

    You’re working from Mary Leitao’s bogus case defintion, and, since you said that some of these patients are treating with physicians, are they not asking for sleep aids, which would also help to alleviate their itching? The mindset of most of the people, on line, that I’m familiar with, is that they want no drugs of any sort, other than antibiotics. They say that the medical community is doing a grave disservice to us all in masking diseases with drugs, rather than curing them. Yep, that is what most all of them, that I am aware of, truly believe.

    I know I have a big mouth and strong opinions, but I have followed these people, here, on the internet, not knowing any of them outside of here, long enough to know what they think and say. I know you’re not at fault for any involvement you have, too, Jace. This doesn’t look good, though, at all, to me.

  30. Maybe you can get Greg Smith to show you the one that ate his eyeball

  31. Jace, what I don’t understand is, if you’ve done all this testing, FTIR, etc, then why can’t you say anything about the chemical composition of the fiber?

    You say you know that it’s not fiberglass, rock wool, etc, since those would show up. That means you’ve got a distinct enough signature to eliminate them.

    What is that signature. What were the peaks?

    And, are you sure fiberglass would show up? Some spectroscopic tests require special handling for fiberglass, since the normal tests involve sandwiching the sample between glass slides, then subtracting the glass signature. But with fiberglass being glass, this leaves an indeterminate result unless you mount the sample in some other way.

    See Bartick, page 3,

    Most other fiber types studied were found identifiable
    by Raman analysis. An exception is glass fibers on microscope
    mounts. Glass fibers produce the same fluorescence
    response in their spectra as the glass coverslips. No
    other features are observable to identify them as glass

  32. And, sorry to be nit picky, but if you did “gas chromatography”, then how did you turn a (possibly fiberglass fiber) into gas? How hot was that?

  33. hey I just discovered this website!…. I’m a little perplexed.
    Why are you trying to “debunk” the Morgellons disease? Why do you think its not real
    when its barely been studied? I assure you, no one’s trying to trick anyone about this.
    My own health problems is the most boring subject on earth for me to talk about, but I felt compelled to make a website about my morgellons problems because I thought it was a danger. But I’m afraid to put its address here in case you use parts of it for ridicule – which you might because this disease is so strange, weird, and unlike anything we’ve ever known.

    If a flying saucer from outer space landed in your neighbor’s yard, would you go over and take a look – or would you stay in your house start a website to debunk the ufo nuts????

    You’re invited to spend a few days and nights at my side, as intimately as we can tolerate, so you have a chance to learn. I’ll check back here in a few days for an answer

    p.s. why are people feeling a need to say untrue stuff like “the one that ate his eyeball”? I thought you scientific analysis types like to stick to accurate facts.

  34. You’re invited to spend a few days and nights at my side, as intimately as we can tolerate, so you have a chance to learn. I’ll check back here in a few days for an answer

    And here we go again ….

  35. Tingtong, if your evidence is so compelling, then why can’t your doctors see it?

  36. What’s so weird about fibers being stuck in a sticky lesion?

    How can you be sure that no one is trying to trick people? What about a medical facility that receives 500 dollars per visit from Morgellons patients? What about a doctor that claims to have isolated the Morgellons pathogen? What about all the snake-oil salesmen on the internet? What about all of the stories that apparently keep changing to suit the need? What about the alleged misappropriation of research funds by the Morgellons Research Foundation? Do you honestly know which of your experiences were real and which were illusions?

  37. Tingtong said, “If a flying saucer from outer space landed in your neighbor’s yard, would you go over and take a look – or would you stay in your house start a website to debunk the ufo nuts????”

    If the flying saucer was there, and I could see it, yes, I’d go and have an up close look. If my neighbor was trying to convince me of something only they could see, I’d try coaxing them into taking a little drive with me. If my neighbor tried to spread the idea to a lot of other people that they had an invisible flying saucer in their yard, I would hope they couldn’t convince others to believe it too, just on their word, alone, and I would try to discourage it if I thought it was damaging to them. If they all had a good time, and nobody was getting hurt, I suppose I wouldn’t mind it.

  38. I haven’t shown it to any doctors, and don’t plan to. They don’t know anything about it, or what to do. Yet. That will take years, because once they know more, they’ll have to make a whole new paradigm IMHO.
    I didn’t say my evidence is compelling. Its usually quite subtle, yet at the same time horrifyingly weird. Weird and subtle like you think things were your imagination until they keep happening. But do I think my evidential videos are quite good.

  39. How do we know that you don’t have non-morgellons blood bourne pathogens.

  40. Tingtong, you haven’t shown it to any doctors, and don’t plan to, and you say they don’t know anything about it, or what to do?

    Now that’s just not true, to be perfectly blunt about it. (Those are somebody else’s words, I swiped. Hehe.)

  41. Well, the symptoms don’t match up with stuff they know or can test for. Many, maybe most people who get this spend huge amounts of time searching the internet trying to find something that matches what they see and experience. That would be a wonderful thing to find! (maybe not Ebola)

  42. Unless you go to a doctor, how can you be sure, though, that what you have is the same thing that everyone else who thinks they have this has?

  43. Smileykins ,
    I wonder whose words you mean? Crustylesion the clown? ha ha
    A few doctors are treating – we all know what drugs, and can get them ourselves, but they don’t know what “it” is, or why or how the drugs help. Garrannteee

  44. You may think you all have the same “it”, but you don’t. Some of these people have already been diagnosed with known diseases that account for all of their symptoms. Colored fibers in lesions are not symptoms. The Morgellons Case Definition is so broad that it encompasses several diseases. Morgellons believers have a very wide variety of symptoms. Why do you think you have Morgellons?

  45. Oh, that was one of Randy Wymore’s funny quotes. I guarantee I know that what you’re saying is true.
    If your symptoms are subtle, and you can hold off seeing a doctor, what are your symptoms, and how ill are you?

  46. If you don’t mind I ask, do you ever have to stay awake for extended hours in your domestic duties and duties as a nurse? Have you ever used amphetamines or methamphetamines to make it through your work shifts? Have you ever been suspicious that some of the things you experienced were illusions? Do you believe that as a nurse you are less likely than the average person to have a delusional disorder? Why do you feel that a new paradyme would be required to explain morgellons?

  47. Eczema is only one common skin disorder, but it causes lesions, and those lesions are sometimes very slow healing, particularly if they are scratched or picked at. Eczematous lesions contain colored fibers, particularly red, blue, transparent, and black ones. As the body attempts to expel these fibers, they appear to be sprouting from the lesion. Fibers also traverse within and between layers of skin, to other locations. These things are also true with other skin disorders.

    I’m not a Morgie, and I don’t believe that Morgellons is a distinct disease. But, I do have some of the symptoms in Mary Leitao’s overly broad case definition for Morgellons. I have memory problems. I also feel disoriented sometimes. So, I guess one could say that I have brain-fog. My eyesight is deteorating. These things are a part of aging. I don’t have lesions, but if I did, they would collect colored fibers from my environment. They would sometimes become statically charged, and seem to move on their own accord. They would appear to sprout from the lesions. Oh, I also experience hair loss. I don’t have any reason to itch, thank God, but if I had healing lesions, they would itch, and if I had a skin disorder that caused lesions, they would itch. Itching can be a sign of healing. Morgies talk about scabs. Scabs are also an indication of healing, if one will leave them alone.


  49. Tailcotton People who think they have Morgellons usually share a lot of unique/unusual symptoms, like the black specks, etc etc. Way more than just colored fibers in lesions.
    There are a lot of websites to learn more from. It takes a lot of words to describe it, but there is a vast sense of relief when you discover your problem has a name, and there are others who understand you.
    #46:I worked midnight to 8am for many years, but slept in the daytime. We used coffee and sometimes pseudafed for sleepiness. I didn’t know where to get amphetamines so I wasn’t tempted. I haven’t worked since before I got this.
    Whatever I think might be weird, illusions, or hallucinations I try to photograph,
    but I think this disease can sometimes cause weird vision things, in me for one. Maybe I shouldn’t have taken the LSD in 1969, after all. As a nurse I think I’m less likely to have the faith and hope toward doctors that most people have, but the omnipotence of doctors is such a common delusion that its not considered a delusion.
    But seriously, now, what is a delusional disorder? I don’t have much experience with psychiatry. Do you mean like schizophrenia? I’m probably too old to get that.
    I feel a new paradigm will be required because this disease does not make any sense at all no matter how long you spend trying to figure it out.This isn’t just new, its very different. I think the puzzle pieces don’t fit together because we’re working in 3 dimensions but need to think in at least 4 dimensions. (Does anyone yet know how?) This is my own thinking that I’ve previously kept to myself because it sounds kooky.
    But you guys seem interested, which is like a treat compared to the people I know here.

  50. Hi, it’s me again, Jace. You’d previously said…

    Smiley- I just took a long time to think out that last post so I didn’t make any errors.

    I’m sorry, I know I’m a nuisance, but I wonder if you could clarify this, because I like to understand things.

    By environmental contaminants he means fibers that would be found normally in our environment- including industrial fibers (carpet, cotton, thread, etc).

    l know what “environmental” means

    Industrial fibers are synthetic fibers, aren’t they?

    “Carpet” fiber is most often wool, which is organic


    “Carpet” can be industrial (synthetic) fibers

    “Cotton” is an organic fiber

    “Thread”, Jace, could be either industrial fibers, or organic fibers


    You’ve ruled out fiberglass, carbon, ceramic, & modified rock wool. You looked in the right database, I suppose.

    Industrial fibers would show up on the mass spec and gas chromatography and those types of fibers are definitely not shown on the databases we’ve looked at.

    Based on the ways you’ve said what you’ve said, so far, I’m sorry, I can’t get it to compute.

    We simply don’t know what the fibers are composed of. It could potentially be something new (or at the very least undiscovered), because the basic “environmental” fibers have been ruled out by testing. Even though we don’t know what the fibers are, I think saying they have to be either organic or industrial is ignoring the fact that it could be something new, or something that has been altered within the body.

    I just can’t get anywhere with that, Jace.

    The ones you’ve seen on the shows were extracted from under the patients skin. I was present on these occasions and saw it with my own eyes- these are the ones we’re testing.

    I’m sorry, this may be easier for you to answer for me. Was the patient’s skin intact, and by intact, I mean, it wasn’t a healed over lesion, with fibers in it, right? It was “seemingly” undamaged skin, with fibers embedded in the epidermis, or were they dermal, and, were they removed by excision?

    Thank you.

  51. Tingtong, are you completely cognizant of how “morgellons disease” came into existence, through Mary Leitao? Do you know how, and why, she did it, and what transpired along the way, for her, and for persons such as yourself, to arrive at your conclusions? I ask, because for many people, who were confused, they weren’t the least bit concerned about her background, only being drawn into this because someone “finally understood & believed”. Now, I can empathize, but that doesn’t make this thing a good thing, as it appears to be, for all the believers in it. I don’t think anybody should have unrealistic expectations of doctors, but it seems that most people who think they have this, did, including Mary Leitao, and that also helped to solidify this. When people have apprehensions about going to a doctor, they should ask someone they know, someone they can trust, to go with them. Another set of ears and another mouth can be quite handy in doctors’ offices. Do you have Lyme Disease, Tingtong?

  52. This is for all those “Morgellons Bashers” out there, do any of you (Smileykins and Tall Cotton) have any of these symptoms? If you do, why not put energy into finding a cure, not a reason. And if you don’t, why don’t you pick on something other than an unknown, devastating disease. You are irritating like flys buzzing around your head on a hot day,

  53. Hi Smiley- Please don’t think I’m ignorant, but I have no idea what you’re asking me. Does it matter whether it’s industrial, organic or environmental? My point is that all of these common sources of “fibers” would be in the FBI database, because all the ones you (and I) have named are common and would show up as such. As for the patient’s skin- it was completely unbroken in that area, the physician had to scrape the epidermis away to grab the fibers. I was the one holding the dermatoscope which magnifies the area and you could see that there was no disturbance of the skin anywhere around the fiber. As for all the mass spec, etc I am not a chemist by any stretch of the imagination, so without repeating 2 years of chemistry I am not someone who could analyze that data. And as far as looking in the “right” database- the FBI database would hold all known fibers. Also, we could find out if the patient got a prescription (from medical records which we are still waiting to get based on IRB and HIPPA), we could even get them to take a picture of the label to show it was filled, but there is no possible way, short of being there with the patient to know whether or not they took the med or threw it out. It’s just not possible for us to be involved to that extent. At some point, we just have to learn to trust our judgement. I would also like to point out one more time that my youngest child has very bad excema- some days she has oozing sores all over her legs and arms and never have I once seen any sort of fiber in it whatsoever. Never. And since I’ve started this job I’ve looked and looked- if I saw that, than it would give me reason to doubt morgellons. My 4 year old who has multiple open lesions and wears colorful clothing has never had a fiber. How can you guys explain that?

  54. Michael,

    I must admit; I just saw your new blog today and only read 11 of the replies so far ( I’m late for work at the moment) but I must say that I have only gotten joy out of your blogs until I read this current one.

    Yep, I’m actually pissed. Not at you; but at this lame-ass excuse…tell you what….the CDC or NIH or the National Science Foundation had better find some new material and post the results by August 31st or I’m dropping names. Not that that is a threat; or that it will do anything detrimental to those sick organizations, but I’m sure in the HELL going to fgive it my best shot.

    Watchout now Communications Industry…..

    Plasma, LED, Photons, Molecular, fiber optics, fibers from the sea, RNA clones, Biotech bubbles, Pea Aphids, Synthentic Vitreous Fibers, Carbon fibers,Glass wool fibers….,Magnets, laptops….., Molecular parasites, Scalpel, electrostatic, quantum cloning and….HAVE I ALREADY SAID THE COMMUNICATIONS INDUSTRY??????????????????

    I’ll stop here, and no offense to you Michael, but they need to hurry the hell up. Looks like they have about 7 days….

  55. Oh, and actually we aren’t working from Mary’s “bogus” case definition- the neurotoxin aspect actually came from us and was incorporated by them. And groupthink does not explain people who have never used the internet and saw a show or article and thought “that sounds like what I have” and they then contact us. Quite a few patients do not even have computers, so I don’t know how they can be explained by groupthink. I’m just saying… We’ve had people sending us journals dating back to 1998 before Mary started the foundation, stating the same sort of symptoms that are now all over the internet. If someone can show me where, on the internet there was any talk of this in 1998- I’d like to see it.

  56. Jace,
    If I understand correctly, the fibers were put into various solvents and the colors did not leech out. But the Gas Chromatograph, in heating the fibers up enough to get a gas signature, left the red and blue fibers black. It seems to me that this would mean that the fibers were soaked in solvents before being placed into the gas chromatograph. Question: Due to the penetrating and dissolving properties of the solvents, would the chromatography signatures of the fibers be altered? I assume that the fibers were not melted or boiled away, since the were only blackened, and since they were later placed in acid, where they fragmented, then dissolved. This would, of course, mean that these particular fibers can no longer be tested, since they no longer exist. Can you also tell me which template from the data base was used in the photograph on this discussion topic? Thank You.
    Tall Cotton

  57. Jace said:

    the FBI database would hold all known fibers

    What on earth makes you think that? If this were true, then why did the FBI just spend $134,000 on an 18 month project to create a database of just 1,800 fiber samples (which were mostly the same US produced fibers in different colors).

    You think all the fiber manufacturers in CHINA send the FBI samples of their fibers every time they change the formula? Do you now have to get a “this fiber is in the FBI database” stamp on your shipping container inspection form at customs?

    Here’s a list of about 20,000 textile manufacturers in China alone, which is probably only a fraction of them, and they probably make several textiles each, does the FBI pre-approve all of their fibers:

    That “Fiber not in the FBI Database!!” is media fluff, it does not mean that the fibers are not environmental.

  58. Jace said:

    We’ve had people sending us journals dating back to 1998 before Mary started the foundation, stating the same sort of symptoms that are now all over the internet. If someone can show me where, on the internet there was any talk of this in 1998- I’d like to see it.

    Jace, I’d like to see what you are talking about there. without seeing the articles I can’t really judge, but are you saying nobody had formication and neurotic excoriations before 1998? Nobody had ALS and DOP at the same time? Nobody had weird stuff emerging from their skin? Of course all the symptoms were there before, for the same slew of reasons, just nobody thought to make a new disease.

    Date: Thurs, Jan 30 1997 12:00 am
    My sister, a 26 year sufferer of Crohns has had the experience of having
    small wood fibers come directly out of her skin. This gave her the feeling
    of being stung by bees. It happened to various parts of her body. It was
    very nerve wracking because she wouldn’t know when they were going to
    appear next. She experienced her last episode four years ago while in the
    hospital being treated for Crohns. Her Dr. observed this happening and had
    no explanation. She is visiting me this weekend and I told her about this
    site and she asked me to ask if anyone has ever experienced this or heard
    about it

  59. I don’t have an answer but foreign objects that enter will always come out.

    We had a patient who at seven years old had attended Catholic school. While riding home on the bus, he started chewing on his rosary and accidently swallowed the effigy of Jesus as it broke off the cross. Scared out of his mind, he decided not to tell anyone.

    Many years later he had a tumor detected in his small intestine. Yes, it was the effigy and the body had formed a tumor around it.

    We’ve also seen wood splinters, broken off pencil points and many other small objects expelled from the skin or covered by tumors.

    Reading this site has really opened my eyes to how volatile the skin is. The really scary thing is that in the tropics and some asian and african countries, there are many more things that damage and infect the skin. Perhaps should change it’s name to “”

  60. And on a different note, here’s someone literally covered with fibers, who claims to have Morgellons, although I suspect pet hairs might be more likely:

    Sadly, this does not seem to be a joke. At least Quigleyetta is Morgellons free for now, as far as we can tell.

  61. Dang- I just wrote a well thought out response and it didn’t send.

    Short version: Tall, the fibers used for mass spec and gas chromatography are not the fibers we soaked in acid. I don’t know what template etc, I haven’t been very active on that side of things.

    Michael- We disagree. Your points are valid, but my point is still that these fibers are NOT something common because if they were they would be identifiable. I don’t know how this whole thing will end. Eventually morgellons will be dismissed or accepted. I have not put my reputation on the line with this. My name and picture are only in one spot on the internet in association with this disease. I don’t want to have this argument with everyone I meet, so I have left when the camera crews, etc arrive. I want to go to med school, period. I want to be a physician and I think I will be able to be more adaptable as a physician because of all this.

    I like the discussions here, and will continue to read and occasionally post, but I can’t let it consume me- my priorities are family, school and work.

  62. Well, I agree with your point (the fibers are not common fibers), and my point is STILL (back from May, when I asked Wymore about it), that if you look at enough environmental fibers, you will find some uncommon fibers.

    Your red and blue fibers don’t even chemically match each other. Which fiber is the “Morgellons” fiber?

  63. True, but if we are seeing these same “uncommon” fibers from multiple patients- then they’re either a)not that uncommon or b)they indicate something more is going on with these patients. Yes I know there are myriads more possibilities, but I like those 2 for now. I think that the fact that the fibers are different actually indicates that they are both morgellons fibers. Like I’ve said, I’m no chemist, but I think color would have an effect on the tests that were run, and if so- red and blue shouldn’t be the same chemically.

  64. LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!

    THANK MICHAELLLONS for showing the Pet tab at cherokeechas’s website!!!!!!!!!

    Quigleyetta looks to be a WONDERFUL moderator for the page!!

    Something POSITIVE and FUN to boot when you check the website.

    Jace – KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK that ya’ll are doing at OSU!!!!!!!! Your time and energy is awesome to have!!

  65. Jace, I don’t suppose you could give us some indication as to how many people you have extracted these same blue fibers from? 2? 20? 200?

    As the for the fibers being different colours and chemical composition indicating they are both “Morgellons fibers”, well, this logic just seems wrong.

  66. 2 that I personally watched them removed, I think between 10-20 when I was gone and 20+ that have been mailed to us.

    Why is that logic wrong? It’s just one more anomaly amongst many. If theoretically we were to believe all the morgellons patients, and they all have red, blue, clear and black fibers- why would you assume they would all be chemically the same? That seems illogical to me.

  67. The logic that an acid mantle that’s too alkaline, interfering with skin’s renewal process, and therefore, holding environmental fibers trapped within the superficial layers of the epidermis, just can’t be entertained. Ha, wonderful. Experiment on that!!!

    Concerning the suspected neurotaxins, well, there are already doctors making money off of that. Will OSU be performing the tests those doctors have for determining neurotoxin poisoning? Are the patients being forthcoming as to whether they’ve used toxic substances, to bathe their skin in, as well as ingesting them, Jace?

  68. Okay, I see what you are saying, that different colors fibers would be chemically different.

    I’m saying that you can get different colors (of, say, cotton), without significantly chemically altering the material. The fact that these two fibers are of fundamentally different chemical makeup seems to me to indicate they had different origins. The chances of there being some new undiscovered entity that produces two DIFFERENT kinds of indestructible fibers just seems so insanely unlikely when compared to a much simple explanation of environmental contamination.

    Of your 30-40 fibers, what is the criteria for sameness that you use?

    And if you have time, a very quick question, how did you heat the fibers to 1400F? I tried some clothing fibers in a kiln at 1400F for 20 minutes, and it vaporized them. I need to find me some fiberglass.

  69. Who are these doctors who are making money off that? I must admit you seem to be privvy to much more information than me. Right now we aren’t going to be doing any neurotoxin studies- we need much more information before we start that (and IRB approval) And actually, the patients are very forthcoming about what they’ve done to their bodies, inside and out. I’ve learned more than I’ve ever wanted to know about the things people will do when driven by desparation. I honestly don’t know how some of them are surviving their “treatments”. As for the first part of your comment, I’m fairly certain it’s sarcastic. I’m assuming this is one of your theories? And how would we go about experimenting on that when we are not approved for human tissue studies?

  70. People wouldn’t even have to be applying, or consuming, anything toxic, if their protective skin is that suffocated. Since the elimination of internal toxins is that compromised, and preventing the exchange of carbon dioxide & oxygen, people wouldn’t be feeling too great.

  71. I don’t know how they heated the fibers. It was not done here on campus- that was done at the police lab. “criteria for sameness?” Again, I’m not the one doing the off campus studies, but my guess would be same width and color based on what I’ve seen, also there are some internal landmarks seen at high magnification. Length could be varied too easily to make it a criterion. I think both scenarios (yours and mine) are pretty equally unlikely. And I have never said the chemical composition was fundamentally different- I have not seen the graphs myself.

  72. I’m sorry, Jace, but I’m not posting anything to promote such doctors which would serve to add onto the dilemma for this set of people.

  73. I totally understand Smiley. I just wanted to make sure you weren’t blaming someone here. We are not making ANY profit from research and we truly do just want to do what is best.

  74. You have probably seen some of my posts where I’ve said Wymore needed to think way back on what he learned a long time ago (you too, for that matter), and that I feel like a dermatology professor ought to whomp him upside the noggin. Well, “NO”, I’m not being sarcastic!!!! Can you tell me the reasons for not thinking about this? Caught up in the hype, maybe?

  75. Jace, I don’t mean to be drillin you. I know only Dr. Wymore could give his reasons for why he got involved.

  76. Jace, here’s some older information.

    This article appeared in the National Examiner during late 1994.

    Horrific Disease Feels like Insects are eating you alive. By: Shelby Loosch

    Elliot’s Disease
    by: Sidney 10/16/99 1:57 am

    “He had fiber things coming out of his hands and underneath his nails and all over his body.”

    “He was convinced his little girl had this as she spoke of the fluffy things, meaning the fibers and fiber balls, but as I recall she had no lesions.”

  77. The basic point here is that you THINK there is some correlation between the finding of particular fibers under the skin of a person and the incidence of neuropathy related symptoms.

    The evidence is all anecdotal, yet millions of people get to watch a TV show that presents this as the next big plague, with sober doctors in white coats and FBI scientists weighing in on the wierdness of it all.

    Yet you KNOW, Jace, that a very large percentage of the people who think they have Morgellons are either mistaken, or simply delusional. You have corresponded with these people.

    I know it’s not your job, so I’m just asking your opinion here, but don’t you think OSU has a responsibility not to propogate myths and fear-mongering? You web site says “you can help by [...] Spreading accurate information and combatting ignorance about the disease“, yet on the same page you spout the MRF bullshit statistics like “There are clusters of the disease in specific geographic regions of California and Texas

    So now I get emails like:

    The Morgellon issue was presented to me by a friend who is concerned about an upcoming church camping trip. It seems he caught the paranoia from a friend of his explaining that Texas has “alot of cases” and he fears the group will become “infected” My advice was to do a little research first before telling everyone.

    Maybe the OSU should fess up and say, no, they actually don’t have any evidence that it’s more prevalent in one area than another, and that practically everything on the OSU Morgellons page is unfounded nonsense.

    It’s unfounded fear-mongering, plain and simple. It is hurting people.

  78. Smileykins said:

    I’m sorry, Jace, but I’m not posting anything to promote such doctors which would serve to add onto the dilemma for this set of people.

    I would hope that people could see the link I posted was obvious snake-oilery, but sadly I fear that they are still making money. The existence of this kind of fraud is another indication of how easily people can be misled, and how institutions have a responsibility not to lend their cloak of credibility to unscientific nonsense.

  79. Michael… why don’t you just shut up for like, even a day… do you listen to yourself ever?… you may run this website, but you don’t run osu or anything else for that matter…

    snake-oilry happens everywhere all the time in every dicipline… get over it… why so passionate about morgellon’s snake-oilry?… protected, vested interest?…

    jace… why entertain these clowns with answers they only intend to pick apart anyway?… you have current and future science on your side, they only have a criminal’s interest at heart…

    shittykins… derms are morons… why don’t you whomp yourself upside the head instead… get it on video and post it… that would be funny…

    people should be concerned about where they are travelling to… the world, including the u.s., are not without hazardous diseases… biggest mistake anyone could make is asking you michael about where it is safe and where it isn’t…

    so your advice to your texas friend was to do a little research first?… where?… this website?… or somewhere else?… i am curious how you would advise someone in that situation… fill us all in dr. Michael…

    damn… your blog comments just get stupider everyday…

  80. Michael, in response to that email, you should tell them that there is no evidence that Morgellons exists, just as there is no evidence that God exists (if we are to be honest here).

    Or, you might tell them that on any camping trip one risks becoming infected, bitten, lost, or falling prey to any number of misfortunate events. Or perhaps they are safer since there will be little driving involved once they arrive at their camping site since most fatalities involve vehicles. Life comes with all kinds of risks; you can’t stop living because of the possibility that something might happen. If they believe in God to begin with, then additional prayers should do the trick. Then again, perhaps you shouldn’t suggest reinforcement of a scientifically unsubstantiated belief.

  81. People can find these doctors & clinics all over the place, anyway, and do. I can’t say that if something happened to render me into a position of despair over the wisdom of conventional medicine, that I might not even, one of these days, fall victim to circumstance. I firmly believe in working with doctors, though, rather than turning my back on them. Not everyone can do that, but too many patients don’t even know anything about the conditions they have, and what to expect from them. It’s all right at their disposal, to access their medical records, and to research all there is to know, but they just don’t do it, for whatever their various reasons are. People that can’t be in charge of themselves are susceptible to anything, and especially when they need others, they think, more than they need themselves.

  82. MAFer, I did not advise him of anything, he was relating a conversation with his friend, and the advice was his own (to his friend).

    Aherah, the point was that they were scared to go to Texas because of a media scare story. One that the OSU participated in.

  83. “shittykins… derms are morons… why don’t you whomp yourself upside the head instead… get it on video and post it… that would be funny…”

    MAF’er, why don’t you kiss my ass, you idiot.

    Aherah, there may not be any proof that God exists, but you’re living proof that the devil does.

    Tall Cotton

  84. My point was that the world is a scary place with or without Morgellons. It sounds like they needed to be reminded of that. In addition, I think it is obvious that there are some very strongly held beliefs in this world that science has yet to verify.

  85. Gosh TC, I’m the devil? Funny, most who know me wouldn’t think so. Why do you? Are we back to your “being saved” as a method to rid yourself of Morgellons?

  86. Entertaining such thoughts is not at all relevant to the existing conditions that mogie people are not treating.
    Well yeah, I guess that’s it, though

    Let’s talk some about credibility and credentials. Those are two GIGANTIC issues that morgies bring up a lot. Some food for thought, just for starters, morgie people…

    Mary Leitao
    Ginger Savely
    Dr, Schwartz
    Dr. Wymore

    And, MAF, if you saw less than satisfactory derm doctors, Were they certified? Did you check ahead, or certainly, after, when you were dissastified? You should have reported them, and found a better one.

  87. I wasn’t referring to religion, up above, I was referring to thought processes.

  88. TC didn’t say you ARE the devil. Shake it up baby, twist and shout.

  89. I was referring to Aherah’s statement, saying that there is no evidence that God exists. There may not be a way to prove it in this life, but there certainly is a lot of evidence. Yes, I am saved. I was save long before I ever heard of Morgellons. Christians can get sick like anyone else. Why do I say that you are proof that there is a devil. Well, let’s leave it this. I think you are evil, and I think you demonstrate it every time you come to this blog.

  90. Michael, am I evil? Because I know more than a couple people who tell me not to come here because they say you are. Just as I don’t hate so easily TC, (isn’t it unchristian to do so?) I also decide for myself what to believe or not to believe about the character of people. TC if you think I am the devil, if you feel yourself in a position to make such judgments, then you must have spiritually promoted yourself. Who are you now? God?

  91. My point was that the world is a scary place with or without Morgellons. It sounds like they needed to be reminded of that. In addition, I think it is obvious that there are some very strongly held beliefs in this world that science has yet to verify.

    You just come across as someone who is real tormented, that’s all, Aherah. It almost seems to defy logic, with your claims that you and your kids are doing so well, currently, with your morgie skin symptoms. You’ve gone from seeming to be a bewidered, scared, and confused, wife and mother, who couldn’t understand anything about what was happening, and who didn’t even seem to want to, back when I first encountered you, into one of the meanest persons there was on Lymebusters message board, when I used to look back in there. Nobody can change things for you, and you don’t need to be treated for depression, you have said. I’m sure you probably wouldn’t consider an anxiety problem might need some looking into, either. Maybe if you became Pumpkin you’ll feel better. I hope you do.

  92. Not evil, perhaps a little mischievous….

    Anyhows, let’s not get drawn into metaphysical semantics. Why not watch Hinkle for a while, some people will probably think she’s the Devil.

  93. MAF, could you stick with one user name. It would save confusion. Thanks.

  94. MAF, I’d wondered why my opinion on what I think a derm professor at OSU should have done to Wymore caused you to say, “shittykins… derms are morons… why don’t you whomp yourself upside the head instead… get it on video and post it… that would be funny…”. I like my new name, but I like “assclown” better. I’m known around here as “Skins”, too, now. If you have seen less than satisfactory derm doctors, were they not qualified and certified? Did you check ahead, or certainly, afterwards, when you were dissastified with the first one? You should have reported them, and found a better one that knew what to do. Like I said before, I don’t know anything about your symptoms, or about your situation. Can you tell me anything, other than the response I pretty much know to expect from you, please? (You’re gonna do it, I know ya are, oh, I just know ya are.)

    I do like you, MAF.

  95. You wasting your time trying to explain stuff to delusional people. The internet has made morgellons real to them and has worsened their lives. They don’t even realize they spend ridiculous amounts of time looking at lint with microscopes and depending on a PHD (not even a real med doctor) to look into this. Not only that, but his research shows nothings that we didnt already know (fibers arent organic). I stopped argueing with these people long ago. Just like I stopped arguing with my schizo friend who beleive he has “bad blood” (long story). If they don’t want help, why bother?

  96. I must have missed something, exactly how do you feel you are helping people? I fail to see how you are accomplishing this goal with closed minds and obvious intent.

    In fact, I believe there is just as big of a story in who you three really are and who you represent, as there is in this illness. the difference being, is that finding out more about you three, will be fairly easy and not too expensive either. Shouldn’t take long to find out either. Regardless, I am certain these facts will be very insightful in relation to my original question of what you hope to gain from your position.

  97. Uh, I am a 23 year old college student with a degree in psychology and getting a degreein business finance. Not working for the gov to cover the up the bottled water and chemtrails accidents

  98. I know, 911. I had a delusional state myself once, for a couple of months, and it was 100% real to me, without any reinforcement. I didn’t anticipate morgies being so compelled as to want to come to this blog, to be perfectly honest. As anyone can see, from the content of their posts, they need us to be non-existent, and they repeatedly give us all of their same, usual, reasons that we should be. People aren’t supposed to think critically, for themselves, but to just believe. They seem to all be saying, “Just shut up already, back me up, and believe me, if you care so much.” Sadly, it all translates differently, and they obviously feel that others will come into the realization that “morgellons disease” is a myth, and they are afraid, it seems, that it will diminish the number of followers. I know how important increasing those numbers are to them. Now, granted, there are going to be all types of people who hear about this for the first time, and become alarmed. That’s been my motivation here, from the start, and I am eternally grateful to Michael for helping such people see the truth behind this. I didn’t expect MAF to answer me, because I’ve spent a lot of time with morgies in the past, so I know they have to be let go. I know they’re all sick, too, as most anyone can tell, and they should not accuse us of thinking that they aren’t. It has to be so hard on their families, and the people they know. They’re here, though, so I kind of pretend that they wouldn’t even be, if they weren’t here trying to learn. I know better.

  99. broken records. Once again, Michael, for your consideration and comments

    PRETORIA, South Africa — Daan Goosen’s calling card to the FBI was a vial of bacteria he had freeze-dried and hidden inside a toothpaste tube for secret passage to the United States.
    From among hundreds of flasks in his Pretoria lab, the South African scientist picked a man-made strain that was sure to impress: a microbial Frankenstein that fused the genes of a common intestinal bug with DNA from the pathogen that causes the deadly illness gas gangrene.
    “This will show the Americans what we are capable of,” Goosen said at the time.

    very eye opening as to the world we live in today. the US turned these scientists away. I do wonder how they support their families today though? And if their employers are friendly to The US. and yes, I’ve been to several physicians, from my primary( who is stumped, but does not doubt the reality of these symptoms) to referred derms to environmental medicine specialists. All stumped but are working towards answers all while using “shotgun” techniques concerning treatments and the establishment of a suseptability pattern. But because of industry ways and work load, can only give so much time to me.

    so come on, attack me some more as I am sure you three have really started to dislike me and the way I upset the predictability of your analysis. And even though this is somewhat comical to me, I still would rather be doing and thinking anything else instead of this illness and you 3 goons.

  100. South,
    I don’t doubt the “reality of your symptoms”, but “if” the cause of your physical symptoms was something mental, how would you know it? You seem to be seeing enough medical experts. Are you expected to shell out money indefinitely? What’s the prognosis? I thought you said that your pathogens were in “dormancy”. Have your symptoms returned? What, exactly, are your symptoms?
    Tall Cotton

  101. Oh, now, just listen to you, South. What do mean “attack you some more”, and that you’re sure the three of us don’t like you? All you have done is ignore me, when I have expressed concern to you. We haven’t been attacking you. South, I appreciate what your mission is, in some way, feeling that you’re helping to make us aware of the dangers we have in the world today. I do think that is really all that you’re hopeful of doing, isn’t it? How are your symptoms, now, and your girlfreind’s?

  102. South, all this talk of bioweapons is meaningless in the context of “Morgellons”, since nobody has been able to demonstrate that people are actually sick with a consistent set of symptoms that deserves to be classified as a discreet pathogen.

    People though AIDS might have been a bioweapon as well. But the first step was to actually establish that AIDS was a problem at all, and not just some coincidences. Once that was done, they could find the cause, which they did pretty rapidly.

    Can you demonstrate that people are sick with Morgellons? Is Morgellons a distinct syndrome?

  103. okay, finally got to finish reading this blog slot….just thinking….maybe Dr.Wymore knows what this is???? HUH???? Yeah, right and maybe the FBI are liers to? They’d be the last f-sticks I’d trust with my life…..(Not the good Doc, but the Feds…arg!)

    People, somone is lying out their GD arse! I hightly suspect it is the USDA and the DOE……

    am I slamming the US Gov’t? You had better believe it…lyings sacs of poop! Hate em’

    Now, why is it that no one ever says anything about Cliff and Greema and TAmTam?? Please, answer me that.
    Is it b/c they too are in w. the biotech communications industrry?

    These are my thoughts and I am free to to think and say them… I am.

    I mean come friggin on people! You can not tell me you believe these lying people….so no one in the world has a damn clue what the fibers are?

    One word….you should memorize this too: BULLSHIT.

  104. shittykins aka assclown aka icequeen aka crackwhore… why would i want one of the only people researching this disease whomped upside the head?… i don’t like you… i don’t think you stand a chance at helping me or anyone else… here, there, anywhere… so yeah, it would be funny if you whomped yourself upside the head and taped it for all of us to see… pretty simple now that i have explained it huh?…

    911… have you counselled a morgellons victim?… would you know one if you saw one?… surely you have not medically diagnosed one one way or the other since you are just a psychology major, not a real md are you?… did it ever occur to you that while the md’s are herding 10 patients an hour through their private money machine that the phd’s are hard at work researching so the md’s will have something brilliant to treat their tough patients with… you know, the ones that have more than moles, colds, and sore assholes… your pretty fucking ignorant for a college boy…

    south… busting these clowns would be a riot… their current rant is not an uncommon one when a secret needs protected… click on my name and remember sometime back an email i sent you… you will know who i am once you click… these 3 are hard to talk to huh?… they want to know all about your symptoms only to tear them down and suggest it is anything other than morgellons… this site is nothing more than a flytrap for the newbies who are scared and searching for an answer for their morgellons symptoms… at least if they stop here the dop diagnosis is free…

    nice job assclowns!… keep it coming… maybe you can blog the fucking fibers and lesions right out of us…

  105. Well, I can only say from my own experience that when I was sick for a couple of months, my own mind was who was lying its arse off to me. If I’d stayed in that state and found MRF, I’d be a morgie, myself. I couldn’t stay there, though. It wasn’t a constant, for me. I used to attempt explaining it to morgies, using the terms, “acute morgellons” and “chronic morgellons”, haha, just as a way of trying to break through. It can’t be done. A sick body can make a sick mind, or a sick mind can make a sick body. That may sound like hogwash, but proper balance is the key to health.

    Oh, I’d love to know whether Dr. Wymore knew what this was before he decided to get himself involved. Um-hmm, um-hmm. Either way, it’s a creepy, creepy thought.

  106. shittykins aka assclown aka icequeen aka crackwhore… why would i want one of the only people researching this disease whomped upside the head?… i don’t like you… i don’t think you stand a chance at helping me or anyone else… here, there, anywhere… so yeah, it would be funny if you whomped yourself upside the head and taped it for all of us to see… pretty simple now that i have explained it huh?…

    Oh, I love you more and more, MAF! I know you wouldn’t want a derm professor doing that to Wymore. That was my little fantasy, and if it were going to happen, it would have already. Of course, I don’t stand a chance of helping anyone that can’t be helped, and I know that. My gosh, I’m not delusional. It would be hilarious to videotape whomping myself upside the head for us all to see. I’ll see if I can get my son-in-law to help me arrange it. I know I’ve asked you before, taking your sweet disposition into consideration, have you got diabetes? Thank you for the extra fun new names!!!

  107. Terrapin Therapy!!!! OMG!!! Another Snake-oil Salesman!!

  108. MAFer,
    What are you doing to help the situation. All I can see from your threads, are that you are unable to except the truth, or any type of answer other than what you persoannly believe. If you are asking Michael, Smily and so forth to blog the fibers right out of you, why don’t you videotape yourself with these “fibers” coming out. The people on this site have simply lived by one rule, “there is no evidence that can prove the existence of Morgellons”.

  109. Sean0w2… how do you figure the clowns here have the truth… there version of the truth is only opinion as well… there is no evidence that can prove the existence of morgellons?…

    well… there is no evidence that can prove morgellons does not exist…

    pick a side then… but writing blogs favoring their agenda will not make the fibers and lesions go away… if it would, then one might be able to say that reading here is a form of therapy… this website is going to straighten us all out and bring us back from the depths of morgie hell?…

    like i said, pick a side… personally i have had this long enough to know better… would you like a dose of it?…

  110. How sad. How true.

    I can understand the necessity to disbelieve what we don’t understand, but nevertheless it is this type of gross egotistical complacency that has allowed this to become an epidemic in this country.
    I ask you smart-ass know it alls this. If my fuXXing dog can get hook worms, and cattle can get liver fluke what makes you think for a second that us, Mammals, could not contract similar parasitic infections? For what reason do you believe that biological
    weapons research is not real?
    You are fucking idiots and should go ahead and remain in your little bubble where everything makes perfect sense because you are obviously spoon fed rich pricks inapt for the task of long term survival on this planet, and “We” meaning the human race would be better off without you spreading your disease. IGNORANCE. So take your profitable agenda and stick it up your ass. We will get you. And when we do, I can promise you the last thing you will need to worry about is a lawsuit, compared to the fact that almost every American owns a gun. I own several. So either way you have a far worse problem then Morgellon, because either you are right and we are crazy people with guns, or you are wrong and we are victims with guns. Either way you’re fucked, of that much I am sure.
    I could give a fuck if you respond. I could give a fuck about the quality of your life as you obviously don’t give a fuck about ours. Psychological. No, reality. As I have said before if you still need proof, sleep in the same bed with a Morgellon patient for 30 days.
    You’ll have all the proof you need. We are going to get you bastards, I promise. I never wanted to get into science and medicine. Just wanted to play my music and enjoy my life.
    But now that I have been left no choice… the engineers of this parasite, that’s your ass.
    London, South, Wymore, and all intelligent enough to see the truth… I got your back and all the friends and ammunition you need. I think it is time now for me to tap my fan base
    And make them aware of what I have been up against. I assure you all, I am well respected by our youth, and they will listen.
    Think before you email me. If I don’t like you, You might contract a contagious virtual disease, but don’t worry it will just be in your head. When your mbr gets wiped and your computer won’t boot, don’t worry it’s just your imagination. You fucking Complacent Pussies.

  111. Systemic said:

    If my fuXXing dog can get hook worms, and cattle can get liver fluke what makes you think for a second that us, Mammals, could not contract similar parasitic infections? For what reason do you believe that biological weapons research is not real?

    Systemic, I do think humans get similar parasitic infections. I also know that the government conducts biological weapons research. There is just no evidence to suggest that either of those things is in any significant way related to the 5000+ people who registered with the MRF. Nor is there any evidence that people are producing fibers.

    People are, however, obviously ill, with a variety of symptoms, which have a variety of causes. They deserve appropriate medical care, and that’s all I ask.

    I am sorry you feel I am spreading ignorance, since that is the opposite of what I am trying to do. If you think there are errors or omissions on my site, I would be grateful if you could point them out so I can address them.

  112. South don’t forget:

    “First they ignore you…
    Then they laugh at you…
    Then they fight you…
    Then you win.” – Mahatma Gandhi

  113. Mafer,
    I personnally know two people who claim to have this Morgellons. I have seen what they call evidence, I have been there when they claim Fibers are comming out of them. And everything I have seen this past 6 months is complete bullshit. They are completely dellusional, despeatly seeking other prognosis other the one they have been given. Do get more personal, one is my mother. I am not saying all cases are the same, because I only know two of these people. She also claims that her two dogs have it, but there is absolutly nothing wrong with them.
    I have chosen a side, not yours. How many doctors have you seen? How many diagnosis have you disagreed?

    TO Systematic,
    First off, I am no where near rich. 2) I come from a blue collar neighborhood in Philly. 3) You can take your guns and shove them up your ass!!!! You obviously have some serious mental problems and need help to talk like that. If it wasn’t for this site, I would have lost my mind about what I am going through. I make this point clear. If this was some goddamn pandemic, contagious, infestation, then don’t you think it would take the CDC just a bit shorter to get to the bottom of this?

  114. Your error is not understanding the very nature of this disease. It disables it’s host methodically. And by the time people are able to say “hey I think I’m sick, the symptoms are to severe for them to appear rational. I pose to you…Open your mind and consider other alternatives other than it’s in their head. How could so many people have normal lives and then wham…lesions….memory loss…..rashes…..Look I really don’t care or need your approval. You and every one else will know the truth soon enough. Rememmber when the plaque of the early 20′s hit we didn’t have answers at first. It is foolish to dismiss so many people as delusional or psycotic becuase we don’t understand. that is the most successful attribute to Systemic disease. and yea it pisses me off to no end when people try to rationalize the unexplainable. Do you think it is delusional that there has been an explosion of cases since 2001? Surely you can’t pass this off as internet hipe or coincedence. I was online and have been online long before you. That much I am sure of unless you were one of the few hundered doctors that were using the “net” as it was called at the time for medical purposes. I actually spent time with Steve Case, president of America Online before there was America Online discussing the marketing implications for business over what was not even “coined” at the time ” The World Wide Web”
    So please just understand that you are accusing incredibly intelligent people of being “delusional”, but understand that in the end it might be you that is delusional.

  115. Don’t forget it was guns that founded this country and it is guns that have protected your complacent ass. And wether you realize it or not in comparison to the rest of the world we are rich.
    So smart ass, why is the cdc now addressing this issue? because it is delusion. right. wake up. I find it disturbing that you don’t believe your own mother. that must be really hard for her, and further more if, let’s just say it is delusion. There is still an underlying cause. Or are you saying that delusion is causeing delusion, because if so it is you that needs mental help.
    do yourself and everyone who is trying to help a favor. go fuck yourself.

  116. And the name is SYSTEMIC.

  117. MAFER, I have studied and interned at a mental health practice. People that I and a supervisor helped counsol those with somatic illnesses. 2 of these folks had morgellons (they didnt know that is what it is “called”) and would bring in all types of specimens for me to look at it. All of this stuff was lint, dead skin, and dead bugs. I was supervised by an MD who would prescribe an anti psychotic and/or depressions/anxiety meds. You would see some slight improvment with meds, but meds dont solve anything. The best thing was behaviorial therapy and stop them from obsessing about thier skin. I beleive this disease to be somatic and the best cure is taking care of emotional issues and stop obsessing over your skin by looking at everything with a microscope and reinforcing the condition by talking to unhealthy people on the net who share similar delusions. The CDC and many doctors offices are having thier time and money wasted investigating a fake disease.

  118. I am not going to discredit anyone. I am not a doctor, but from what I have seen, I have the right to draw my own conclusion. If you have a problem with people expressing their opnions, or their anylysis of the subject, them move to N.Korea, Cuba, or wherever you are not allowed to freely express what you feel.

    What I have seen up close and personally, is DOP. Maybe it is schitzophernia. But it is not some unproven, unreconigzed disease. If you are truly having fibers come out of your skin, or multiple lesions, than go see your doctor. Even Wynmore has stated that. Stop taking the advice of some whacked out mother, who also did not want to listen to medical professionals.
    All Michael is trying to do, is put out there that not all people are suffering from the same thing, and none of this is connected. People are self-diagnosing, and hurting themselves more by not listening to thier practioners.

  119. systemic… i can relate… i was once a drummer, but the fatigue and lesions got the best of me… you’re way sick man… i say drop the fucking hammer…

    these clowns are disinformationalists… most of their own sentences and fragments thereof reveal that…

    Michael… as far as errors and omissions… this whole site is an error in that it’s sole purpose is to help cover up a crime… omissions you ask?… yeah, no omissions here bozo… your content is only a subset of the whole… everything else is an omission…

    smileykins… ok, you got me… several of my friends have always told me how easy it is to start a relationship and/or fall in love on the internet… well after some careful consideration, i think i love you too sweety!… i just hope you are not a fatty because i really don’t like fat chicks… and i hope you don’t have too many scars and scabs all over your skin… don’t really care for that either… kinda grosses me out you know… hope you are not one of them real skinny bitches either… you know, the ones with the boney chicken frame, big nasty camel toe, narrow cheek bones, caved in eyes, and bad teeth… i would probably need a whole case of viagra if i had to deal with that…

    ahhh… the joys of being in love… i just want to shout…


  120. Systemic said:

    Do you think it is delusional that there has been an explosion of cases since 2001? Surely you can’t pass this off as internet hipe or coincedence.

    Firstly I’m not dismissing anything or anyone as delusional. I am saying that delusion is clearly involved in a significant number of cases. As you say yourself, the delusions might be a symptom of something else.

    To your question, how can you say there has been an explosion of cases? How were the cases recorded before 2001? How were they recorded after 2001? If nobody was counting Morgellons cases before the MRF started their media campaign, then how can you say the number of cases increased? How accurate is the current count?

    And why can’t internet hype be playing a small factor in this? You work in the entertainment industry, you know how things are with large numbers of people, sometimes people are influenced for incorrect reasons.

    Systemic, do you know anyone with Morgellons?

  121. You know what Systemic, I am comming to the conclusion that you are just some fucked up dude, with serious mental problems. Steve Case, yeah right, and I am having lunch with Bill Gates tomorrow.
    The CDC has to investigate this, that is what they do.
    About my mother, read my post in the Nancy Hinkle blog. She is just plain Crazy, and is doing nothing more than searching around to prove she is right. She has been told by three doctors, and her psyciatrist that she is dellusional. Oh, she also has a long history of depression, and has been on many anti-depressants for years. She is also an alcoholic, who drinks while taking her medication. But I guess that would have nothing to do with what she is suggesting she has.
    I am doing a favor for the people who are trying to help, I am spreading the word about this website, so people can be properly informed of the truth, and not listen to redneck whackjobs who want to threaten to kill people because they don’t believe them.

  122. It has been my experience in life that those who are defensive are guilty. So why so defense?
    I have no use for this blog and for the obvious jaded / politically motivated views here. I don’t even own a microscope and don’t need one to know that something fucked me up. But I will give you this. Maybe there is something else causing the problem. Maybe it is being confused with Morgellons. This much I know. It is not delusion. And if you would stop assuming for a minute that you knew it all you too could benefit from this wisdom. I guess that fact that it is effecting nurses #1 and teachers #2 has no practical implications. I am done here, And you guys who are claiming to help are useless. As i said before the truth will come out. were will you be? who did you study under? Doctors with the same complacent egotistical arrogance?
    Why did you get in the medical profession anyway? Money. probably.
    And the only problem I have is the ignorance of american society as a whole. keep watching your tv and keep believing what you what. in the end your opionions will have no effect on reality. so sleep on that
    Mr. God Like entity.
    it’ ok to be afraid of the things you don’t understand, but to discredit other people, that just being a coward.

  123. Systemic Says:
    August 24th, 2006 at 9:58 am
    Your error is not understanding the very nature of this disease. It disables it’s host methodically. And by the time people are able to say “hey I think I’m sick, the symptoms are to severe for them to appear rational. I pose to you…Open your mind and consider other alternatives other than it’s in their head. How could so many people have normal lives and then wham…lesions….memory loss…..rashes…..

    That is absolutely spot on. Well said.

    Sean0w2 Says:
    August 24th, 2006 at 10:09 am
    All Michael is trying to do, is put out there that not all people are suffering from the same thing, and none of this is connected. People are self-diagnosing, and hurting themselves more by not listening to thier practioners.

    Don’t you think the CDC need to be the judge of that?? After all Mr Dan Rutz has been quoted to say in the newspaper that they are taking this seriously.

    And also – I for one do NOT obsess over my skin, what am I to do shower in a damn rain coat, just so I save myself from actually having to see the damn fibers coming out of places they shouldn’t???!!

    I agree that a lot of us my not have the same symptoms, BUT you obviously ain’t no scientist or doctor like me, so statements like —oh these people are just obsessing over their skin —is not helping to sort out this problem really is it??

  124. Systemic, I just want people to get appropriate medical care. I want them to get well. I’m open to all suggestions, I just ask that people don’t make claims that affect the health of vulnerable people without some scientific basis for those claims.

    Could you be a bit more specific about what on this site you have a problem with. I don’t say people are simply delusional. My position is at the top of the left column on every page:

    The Evidence Indicates:
    1. The fibers are environmental and unrelated to any illness
    2. Morgellons is not a distinct disease
    3. “Sufferers” have a mixed variety of physical and/or mental illnesses.

    What part of this do you have an issue with?

  125. Actually yes, The last two people that lived with me in the same house have contracted the same symptoms, even though we no longer live in the same state and are no longer in direct contact. So have their girlfriends. The only thing in common was residence. Look I like any other descent human being do not want to hurt anyone. but guns hurt people and they are real, so why is this not? because you say so. I don’t think so. Not that simple. and that’s my point. Yes people are getting infected at an alarming rate. Biotech release 3600 gentically altered parasites in pheonix arizona on a goverment owned facility for testing. Fact. And have you stopped to think about how you would feel if your mother wasn’t crazy? Either way it’s your mom, and I am no redneck. If I was god help you. I know a few though. I am sure the cow breeding, beef providing portion of this nation would love to know how you feel about them. Rednecks that is.
    assumptions and sterotypes are the exact problem here.

  126. I am not a doctor, I am simply a family member of someone claiming to have the same symptoms as you people. I am not defensive, but I will get pissed off when someone goes off on tagents about the south, and guns. Honestly, the only reason I am even posting, and reading is because of my personnal dilemma.
    I will not discredit Wynmore, or any type of MD, or even Mary L until the truth comes out. If it comes out that Morgellons is real, then I will be the first to apologize to the people posting here. But not to the two people I know personally. I have been there, and seem them, and there is nothing comming out of them, no lesions, no fibers, just pure dellusions.
    If the CDC discredits Morgellons, where will you be? I am assuming back to your doctor. But why wait, go now and get relief from whatever you are suffering from.

  127. Systemic – when were the 3600 genetically altered parasites released? Do they fit into this ie. the years from 1996 onwards then 1998 etc etc. I do know that GM contamination stated in 1996 and we have heaps of it in Australia. Is there any evidence to say when this GM contamination will die off or disappear, or is it here to stay?

  128. My problem when reading some of the posts here is that people are quick to attack other people and rule out the possiblity that hey, maybe something is going on. Not that I want to personally attack anyone, I just want to say hey, what if it was you? I am definately not looking to fuel paranoia, but I am absolutely, Like you, looking for the answers neccessary to protect the people I love and cherish.
    With that said, I have bills to pay like everyone else. so Off I go.
    Let me say that I want the world to be nothing more than a peaceful loving place, but there are those that want nothing more than to hurt us. Why I do not know. But if I was to explore any area of mental delusion that would be it. Not people suffering from the obvious physical symptoms of a horrifying condition.

  129. If people have evidence of such things taking place ie. release of GA altered parasites – then give your evidence to the government. Wouldn’t that alone be a start at least, to me it sounds awfully wrong and human lives would be at risk no doubt?

    Once again – who do you blame? Who can draw that conclusion – the CDC I feel.

  130. how many docs?… 17 so far… followed their protocols… paxel, lexapro, orap, etc…. they help with a variety of disorders… paxel and lexipro diminish the obsessional behavior to a degree… and, they calm your nerves down somewhat so that you are not quite as aware that a parasite is eating your nerves and screwing up your seratonin levels… they DO NOT decrease fiber growth

    orap was a pretty good anti-schizo drug in the past… as well as a swine de-wormer… it has made a comeback recently in derm offices… given in low dose (1-2mg a day) for neuro-excema… go ahead give orap (pimozide) a try… the side effects are risky even at low dose… and it kills parasites if you have them… enjoy the painful, hard nodules you will get as they die off… i know there are better alternatives to pimozide…

    symptomatic treatment to leave you in ignorant bliss and make big pharma rich… no thanks… fuck all of you…

  131. Sarah, here’s what Systemic might have been referring to:,kick,25988,1.html

    It’s inevitable that GM parasites will become commonplace as replacements for pesticides.

    GM has been in use for decades, with no ill effects detected.

    But this is all off track – there’s no evidence of anything connecting GM parasites to Morgellons. If there were parasites, there would be microscopic evidence.

  132. Sarah please understand as others are concerned about here, I am not trying to fuel this. We should all talk to our doctors as I have.
    But here is a link that may help.
    But ultimately if you want to see the organism behind morgellons go to
    that might at least put your mind at ease on what we are truly up against.
    anyway peace love and all that our fathers and their guns have fought for.
    delusional or fact may the truth find its way.
    for those that do not know.
    Systemic = a process that affects an entire body or system is therefore said to be. SYSTEMIC

  133. SeanOW2 – Ok I believe you when you say these two people are delusional – yes it happens – I guess we will always have people in life who think they have something when they haven’t. Some people need a ‘label’ in life to feel safe I guess.

    I have had my treatment for chronic rickettsiosis, and I do hope my recovery will continue (positive mind focus). I just to hell wish that I could find some written evidence that rickettsia could cause this manifestation to the skin, and all the hitchhikers in my skin – because that would be enough for me. I don’t need a new name like Morgellons to help me move on. I think a plain old simple explanation or validation to explain a symptom which even doctors can see. Come on – it really isn’t too much to ask for. I for one, like others are saying – we should not have this stuff inside of us. That is why we have an outer layer – SKIN, it protects us. Maybe blame it on the ozone depletion – that would suit me, environmental disease, 21st centuary disease. Why is this happening to me NOW and others NOW. It never used to.

  134. I’ve had a lot of illness in my life, and been around a lot of it too. I’ve never seen such displays from sick people before, as these, other than the nearest thing I can compare some of the on line behaviors to. It seems real similar to senile dementia/delirium, and/or those same mental effects from uncontrolled diabetes. Depression, anxiety, obsessive-compulsive disorder, and some fairly apparent personality disorders abound. (Morgie friends, I’m not “diagnosing” and not I’m not trying to convince anyone that I don’t have my own idiosyncrasies. I own mine. I’m also not professing and protesting to anyone that I’m ill, or saying that my behaviors are not a source of trouble, as you do.)

    Jace, if you’re still around, can you shed any light on this for us? Has Dr. Wymore got it into his head, like many of the morgie people have, that they have neurotoxicities from being infested with biogenetically engineered cotton, or other synthesized fiber? Is that what he doing? I haven’t read every source of info on him, and for anyone else who hasn’t, I’ll share this..

  135. Sara,
    I wish that more people had your thiking process about this. My opnion is that most people are just clinging to an answer other than what they want to hear. You are trying to deal with and treat what your doctors have said you have. I hope you all the best.
    One thing people still have to realize, is that Morgellons is still not a recognized disease, and leagally can not be a diagnosis. So, until,if ever, the CDC, and the medical community claim this to be a diesease, none of you have Morgellons.

  136. A moth crossed with a jelly fish? Am I meant to take that seriously? A new name I heard recently through the grape vine is “Morg Monsters”.

    This is completely insane really!!

    Look Dr Wymore comes across as a good man on the TV reports, but he has looked at this through the scope for over 12 months. Neurotoxin has been thrown around also. Ok I don’t under the science and tests involved. BUT wouldn’t you think we would be at least a bit closr. Mary L said that her and her husband were researching this themselves. She stated that they were so close to figuring it ALL out when he died! Well then Dr Wymore comes in and takes over, simple math – wouldn’t he have been able to fill in the gaps??

    In the early days, I was receiving emails saying he has found fibers with barbs – yes like tapeworm. Right on the nose with that one, from my experience with this. Also people had all sorts of terrible worms, parasites that they really shouldn’t have. Then Mary said that they now all the organisms there is to know – and that none of it made any sense. She quoted that a pathologist looked at some fibers and said only nanotechology could do this sort of thing.

    So if this is the Bollworm – the horny sexually active moth wearing a jelly fish suit – wouldn’t it have some sort of DNA?

    I think if I have to continue to live with these symptoms and be given a name or diagnosis to explain them I think I prefer maybe diabetes or HIV, not an experiment gone wrong or whatever. Because yes this does feel like an experiment. I said that from the word go, and I had never even been on the internet – so I had no clue about all these conspiracy theories. Maybe though this is part of dementia when one sees blue fuzz “I am part of a government experiment”. I do not know why the hell I said that years ago, but it was my first thought. Because skin should not produce this crap, not in an otherwise healthy individual. Look psychiatric medication could have done this to me, my parents have said often enough, those psych meds. did you a lot of damage – but heck I can not turn back the clock, or start blaming doctors for misdiagnosis. I just want an explanation. WHY is this shit in my body? How do I get it out of my body? and would it stop taking my skin for a ride and rearranging my face overnight, so I look like a twisted sand shoe in the morning.

    Don’t the medical community have some sort of duty of care policy they must follow?

    I want to know if Doctors that see patients with Morgellons symptoms contact the local health department? If my doc says he believes there is an infectious agent involved in what he sees in me, that HE refers to as Morgellons – then I would hope he has phoned the health department. I am working with my doctor, what more can I do. I am not going to pressure the man and insult him by saying, I do hope you have phoned the health departmnet. I would like to believe this man is being truthful with me and not just trying to perpetuate what naysayers are calling purely a delusion? Why would he do that? To me he just wouldn’t. Please do not under estimate or insult my intelligence. I am looking at this in a rational way I feel.

  137. Systemic – Silentsuperbug. I can not be foolish enough to believe that I am sorry but I need much more evidence than avideo through the internet. Is he a scientist? give me his credentials? Mary said he was a poet! If I was to send that to my shrink (who by the way is an Associate Professor of Psychiatry you would know his name – well renowned in the USA and worldwide) he would for certain say to me how can you believe that, you need proof, and maybe you should take a pill.

    Sean0W2- Thank you – and yes I agree we do not have Morgellons, but if we want to describe and put a name to a symptom not yet in a medical text book – call it Morgellons. Personally I hate the word. My ma calls them doobies – she said it like a damn plant growing in you.

    Morgellons is not a documented disease or is it as yet proven as a real disease – BUT WHY do fibers come out of the skin and everything else??? Just someone please explain why this can happen, and how?

  138. People are also clinging for an answer because SOMEONE kept promising them that they would get an ANSWER. This really is unfair to promise things to the sick and vulnerable.

  139. Sarah,
    this is what I believe Michael has been saying all along.

    “People are also clinging for an answer because SOMEONE kept promising them that they would get an ANSWER. This really is unfair to promise things to the sick and vulnerable.”

    Mary L, the MRF, and Wynmore have been giving false hope to people who need real help. They are the reason my mother still hangs on to this delusion. Like I said before, I don’t know what other people are going through, but my personal experience’s have been that Morgellons is not real. I truly do believe that there are people out there experincing all types of things. Shit, that medical mysteries program had a goddamn wearwolf on it.

  140. MAF, I’m sorry, but I’m taken already. I still love you, though, just not in a romantic way.

    Systemic Says:
    August 24th, 2006 at 10:40 am

    My problem when reading some of the posts here is that people are quick to attack other people and rule out the possiblity that hey, maybe something is going on. Not that I want to personally attack anyone, I just want to say hey, what if it was you?…

    Tall Cotton & Smileykins “got attacked”, basically by coming here to speak our minds, after defecting from the cult last fall. Sorry to cause a problem.

  141. Systemic has a problem expressing his opinons with a thought process. He has been quick to rant, threat, but has backed away when confronted with his thoughts. I would like to see a well thought, easygoing response to some of the questions brought to his attention.

  142. Sean, that’s been a pattern common to nearly all the “Morgies” when they first come here. They immediately attack and call the “non-believers” all sorts of names, make threats, and imply that we are all part of the conspiracy against them. Some get over that, but most do not.

    Sarah Connor is a completely changed person since she was banned from LB (imho the best thing that has happened to her, even though it was obviously quite a stressful event at the time) and has told us that she was SENT HERE by the founder of the MRF on a mission to attack this blog and its participants.

    While I may disagree at times with Sarah’s conclusions, I greatly respect her new, logical approach and further think it says a LOT about breaking away from groupthink.


  143. I just don’t understand why Mary L, and some of the “morgies” want to discredit logical thinking. Are they so determined to prove their cause, that they can’t listen to anyone else’s opnion? I will bet all the money in the bank, that they are Democratic Liberals, who do not want people to make their own decisions or conclusions to this unless it is non-bias to thiers.

  144. “F-e-a-r”. That’s the driving force behind it. Some people are delusional and seeing things and misinterpretting them. Some are, in the respect that they’re ill from other, real causes, and misinterpretting that, also. Who knows what’s going on with everyone. Listen to them, all, though… “F-E-A-R”. That’s a really easy thing to capitalize on.

  145. I am going to assume that Mary L, and the rest of the MRF, and the people affliated with them are looking at this blog. Why don’t they just show themselves and directly answer some of the questions. Stop hiding behind closed doors, and let the public know what your reasons are. I am seriously worried not just about the people in my life, but all of the people out there hurting themselves, and others by not listening to reason. I am not going to say that some people are not suffering from somethig, but where is the proof? What has OSU and the CDC found thus far? Stop rambeling about a mysterious disease, and show the hard facts! There are people out there who are suffering, and just hanging on to your answers that have not yet come!

  146. Hooray and well said!!

    Yes come on down you folk and lay your cards on the table – you started this damn mess – let us know what you know.

    Remember Mary you kept saying – we think cyanobacteria involvement, we know it does creates very long and very large cellulose, I mean FINE but WHY tell me THAT I am NOT a Scientist, that will NOT get ME WELL…it just makes an innocent sick person maybe worry unnecessariliy. WHY did you do that?? you know —- stick your clutches in me as A means to promote your MONEY COLLECTION COMPANY HERE IN AUSTRALIA?? am I just a stepping stone to help join up universities and research, and people who just want to make money by confusing a group of people who have chronic illness of some form.

    The carrot the MRF dangled has gone real moldy – an absolute disgrace – so called intelligent, well educated, professional, mothers, fathers, whatever you call yourselves. Act like consenting, responsible ADULTS, and be responsible for your actions.

    I do not know who is organising this MORGELLONS festival, BUT to be perfectly honest what is this going to achieve?? Yes silly question, but is it not just getting off the whole issue here??

  147. Can the CDC maybe step up and make an annoucement to perhaps calm down the situation a bit?

    Even if they don’t have any real answers, but at least recognition that this is really taking place and the people who started it all (MRF) perhaps need to be investigated as to are they who they say they are, evidence please, what is the geograph for the rest of the world. We can not just continue to trust one persons take on this, ie. we have evidence of it in every country in this world, apart from the Antartic. My goodness if this is just all a bit of a side show, someone has to come un stuck sooner or later. It is just getting more and more off the planet.

    I was not referring to the fact that I am infected by Aliens either okay, but you know anything is possible. I can’t decide you know, do I wanna wear a space suit, or do I wonna be a morg monster…. gee I just can’t decide.

  148. Sarach said…

    “The carrot the MRF dangled has gone real moldy..”

    That’s the truth if I ever heard it.

    Tall Cotton

  149. backed away, hardly. Rant. that’s what a blog is for. threat, why are you guilty? I just don’t have time to sit here on the internet and entertain your delusion. as I said, I do know that most of these people are suffering from REAL SYMPTOMS and if Morgellon is the name for now so be it. We will know soon enough what the underlying cause is. Then I will return, until then you are just wasting your breath, and infinatly more important, my time. I have better things to do, like talk to people who are working the scientific end of this problem.
    Just because you know a couple of people who are nuts doesn’t mean that thousands of people in all 50 states sharing identical symptoms are.
    You are the one that should get your facts straight before ranting.
    I guess some people would like to cling on to the world as it used to be, as they need it to be, because the reality of the ladder is just to hard for them to accept or understand. nevertheless reality is reality.

    One final note. Have any of you taken the time to look at the EPA report on Premethrin, which is found in a lot of household products, like flea killer for your dog? Might check that out before you go on blogs telling people they are delusional. I bet you have a loved one that has this stuff in their house right now. or maybe you already new this and that is your reason for being here.
    anyway, good luck to all of you suffering.

  150. p.s. Sarah you can email those guys at silentsuperbug and they will get back to you. At least they did for me. I don’t know if it has any real bearing for your health concerns, but I do know they emailed me back promptly with a reponse.

    One other thing to consider.
    Beryllium Oxide exposure in the work place.


    “If you are sane enough to know they think you’re crazy,your crazy if you let them tell you -that you are insane..think about it!!”- LeanneDenise(c)2006


    2Jo 1:6 And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.
    love in Jesus, Leanne

  152. Thanks systemic – I don’t really want to email those people. I put my faith in the CDC they are the government, and they do have the final say, that is the truth and the law I THINK?? It will just bring me more grief emailing a fellow in Europe about an experiment gone wrong. Look they could be SPOT on but it is not for me to judge or decide, I am not qualified for that.

    Berylium Oxide exposure – interesting – never heard or it – I guess that will take yet another google search to explain. It this THING the BO found in places like big hospitals, as I have worked in MANY? Is in the building material? or is it in the air cooling system?

    I took a look at the website, the open ended question there is dust from a palm tree causing this. Well if you WANT MY personal opinion with my symptoms, I HAVE NO IDEA!!!

    I think maybe Porky Pig caused the whole damn thing and we may need to bring in Daffy Duck to sort the whole thing out, but he is too busy sterilizing cots for the festival, and he really over trained last night for the pathogen race and pickathon – BROKE 3 nails, now he needs an emergence manicure – heck what next?

  153. Hi Smiley

    I’m not sure exactly what you’re asking me. Did you need me to read through all those articles or was your main question about the GM stuff? “Has Dr. Wymore got it into his head, like many of the morgie people have, that they have neurotoxicities from being infested with biogenetically engineered cotton, or other synthesized fiber?” I can honestly say that we have never seriously discussed anything bioengineered or synthesized as a cause. And just FYI for people who are reading and wondering why there hasn’t been much forward movement on our research: first, we are still (patiently?!) awaiting IRB approval so that we can do our experiments with skin or biopsies that have been aseptically removed by a doctor. We all have bacteria on us every day, so most of the cultures I’ve grown in the last 9 months have been normal skin contaminants. We really won’t get very far until we know who, what and where these samples are coming from. Secondly there are only three of us working on this. Three people dealing with media, patient calls and emails, etc. There just isn’t a lot of time for hard core research which is what we so desparately want to be doing. I can’t tell you how hard it is to call people and tell them that essentially we don’t know anything about what they’re dealing with. It’s hard. If it turns out that there is no such thing as morgellons, I don’t think that we lose any credibility- we are looking for common denominators. If there are none- than at least a full study has been done to determine that. I think the addition of our epidemiologist is finally going to get us some data to analyze. And I believe someone asked me the other day where the CDC is at in their investigation- I don’t know. Hopefully soon we’ll all know something and all this sniping and rudeness on websites such as this will stop. I just don’t understand all the ugliness- it accomplishes nothing. I was really beginning to enjoy reading this blog and then I see statements from the people we are trying so hard to help that they plan on shooting people. I’m sorry, but that thought just makes me sick. Yes, we disagree, but I think it’s been shown that we can disagree nicely- much more is accomplished that way. Please angry people, think about what you say and how it makes you look before you say it. Seriously, I’m on your side and those statements make it easier for me to understand why people might not believe you.

    Sorry that was kinda rambly.

  154. Jace – you know if Dr Wymore is really doing the right thing to help US, I take all of my HATS off to that man and yourself. What a position to be in.

    And if the CDC really are a decent bunch of people they would maybe communicate with Dr Wymore, and talk about this situation over a cuppa of tea, look at the evidence so far.

    I am ready for a plastic bubble and specimen collection. It isn’t Morgellons Disease because I can’t find this in a medical book. And if I do have DOP what is the current treatment available? Because I have eaten good food, I think maybe drunk TOO MUCH water in my life, and I DO wash myself, for those who think we are a little crazy and have poor hygiene.

    How can you tell what is really going on until you erect a tent in the middle of paddock,

    All those claiming to have the fibers, the dancing hair and all the weird goings on, NOT to mention PAIN that is NOT controlled with modern meds.

    Everyone IN THE TENT TOGETHER – Lets take a look at the live specimens – THE PEOPLE.

    What did they DO when SMALL POX was an issue?

    Come on you clever people on this website – my dad told me about this (small pox) – after driving me home from the Hospital yet again with his very sick, bald, bloated daughter – dropping fibers in the car (he said “throw it out the window love, no offense”)!! we call them delusions coz we need to laugh.

    Don’t you think a top notch Associate Professor of Psychiatry would want to help me with DOP if he believed I had this?

    If some doctors on this website want his name, get Morgellons Watch to pass on my email address. Please talk to the man. Get his opinion. I have nothing to hide. I can only speak from my experience on this.

    All MY symptoms being called Morgellons were well and truely there before the MRF band wagon started, and personally I could have done without that media hype side track to detract from the real issue, but it seems some wanted to play games, and make money on the way.

    But my question is, WHY is the human body storing stuff that looks like human hair and fluff??? and you know what the lesions even look similar to small pox. I said that long along, but someone said – NO WAY, not possible. Anything is possible in this world. Look at the Tsunami and the earth moving off its axis (or whatever) is that a delusion also? Mother nature can be cruel at times, BUT she does this for good reasons I think, to put naysayers in their box.

    I am what the medial community would call a PATIENT.

    Now then – if the medical community did not have a patient to learn from about a disease what would they do??

    Take notes from the little tiny mice, who has a tummy full of spirochetes anyway?

    We may just be the innocent victims, BUT the truth is WITHOUT US YOU ARE NO ONE and GOING NOWHERE?

    You have to take a look before you can dismiss this.

    Chronic fatigue Syndrome – proven now – real. Well there is a GOOD place to start for a formal study of a large group of people with the same thing.

    What causes it? NO IDEA

    How do you treat it and cure it? NO IDEA

    Do you remember the website which was CFS/Rickettsial and Chlymadial research? Well it has SHUT DOWN.

    The man who owns it has had CFS for 12 years. He is too sick to keep up the website, not enough money, nor time or energy to continue research, ask permission for documents etc. He said his health is very very poor. This is SO SO sad. If anyone hasn’t seen the email I will gladly forward a copy.

    So if you want to knock Morgellons on the head, be my guest go right ahead -


  155. Sarah, you are obviously very physically ill, and in no way would I ever want to belittle that. But it really does not seem like there is much evidence that what you have is the same as what other people have. I’m glad that you are working well with your doctors, and that is the best course of action for anyone who thinks they have a novel disease.

    If there IS a new disease that some people have, then diagnosis and treatments will only come after clinical and epidemiological studies by people like Wymore, and the CDC. That will take some time. In the meantime, people need to work with their doctors to best treat their individual symptoms.

    I feel there is not enough evidence to even merit these preliminary studies by the CDC, and they are doing it mostly for PR reasons (and to stop people bugging them). But that’s a moot point now, and I await the results with great interest.

    I don’t think you mean smallpox, that’s been around for thousands of years, and is mainly interesting for it’s role in the development of inoculation and vaccination. Look to AIDS or SARS for a better analogy.

  156. Jace, Lets be clear on something. I am not planning on shooting anyone. I was simply trying to make the point that I am in support of the ongoing effort to solve this whatever it takes. And that We will get to the bottom of this. Maybe I should have chosen better metaphors. sorry if I offended any of you. That was not my intention. It is very offensive when people try to tell you your delusional when they are the ones living a perfect bubble. I guess I am just really tired of hearing that when I know beyond all doubt that something has made us very sick and all people know how to do is throw stones at your sanity. So I threw a few cheap ones back and for that I am sorry. You are right it does not make our plight any easier, and I will keep that in mind for future reference.

  157. Systemic – you didn’t offend me – I don’t see who you could even blow my head off through the computer screen if you tried or wanted to (only joking), I read between the lines, that this is purely a written expresion of your frustration just like mine. And I am more than happy for people to point out if I am wrong about things, this is how I learn anyway by my mistakes. So no need to apologise on my behalf, hope you feel better soon.

  158. Michael – yet again you point out good stuff, you know that, but remember someone has to be accountability for us even talking about this stuff do they NOT??? Yes I’m doing what the doctor says, but geepers I want an apology one day, if I have been used by some messed up people. Reasonble request I feel, whilst we wait for research and the cdc, yes takes times, I have plenty of that, but it sticks in my back like a knife that people do this stuff. Christ all mighty I am only human and very tired.

  159. Jace, you said, in your closing remarks, “Seriously, I’m on your side and those statements make it easier for me to understand why people might not believe you.”

    That has everything to do with why I’ve been stunned that Dr. Wymore jumped into this, head first, with blinders on. From the beginning of his involvement, I have had questions concerning “his” sanity. Ginger Savely, Dr. Stricker, Dr. Schartz, and anyone making a profit off of these people, well, sure, anybody can see their motivations. I know you defend this as “not” being a project he’d chosen for graduate studies, but I could swallow it somewhat easier thinking that was the case.

  160. Tallcotton said:


    This is BugsAlive, now know as Tallcotton, still swinging his sword.

    NUSPA anyone? Still got some.

  161. Yes, Tall Cotton was known as Bugs Alive, and, I, Smileykins, am the former, Adapted.

    Tell all of us the point you are trying to convey, Texastar.

  162. Man, I missed you guys whole dialoge……Now Sara, I love you and you make me crack the hell up…so don’t be offended, but I have to repeat what you said in one of your post up above….

    “If people have evidence of such things taking place ie. release of GA altered parasites – then give your evidence to the government.

    ahhhh…..HAHAHAHAHAHA…. Lil Sarah, it’s the gov’t that is releasing them……

    and Systemic, don’t want to say anything rude here b/c I like TAMTAM, but that is all. I don’t believe a damn word he says. I think it’s all a diversion tactic.

    And silent superbug….well, go back to the very frist frame of the video….it says made by who??????

    Bell Labs… know, the subsidiary of my favorite Co. Lucent Tech….yep, gotta love it, eh? and you are right, we are bursting their arses….why do you think they get so mad at me for only wanting to pass along factual info on that forum? Why? B/c I know too much and they are trying to cover it up….but hey, I love guns too and I say bang bang….(just kidding)

  163. Texastar,

    We’ve told everybody that already. It’s no secret. By the way, what name did you use? Oh yes, I still have my sword!

    Tall Cotton

  164. [Deleted at the request of the author]

  165. I’ve had problems with ‘fibers’ since I was a child although I didn’t
    know that was the problem at the time. The airing of Primetime was like a new ray of hope!
    It is my belief, based on the medical problems I’ve had throughout my life
    and where/what I was doing at the time that these fibers are asbestos and fiberglass.
    I know many people suffering from this ailment that don’t even know they have it yet. I see the same effects on their bodies and skin as I have seen
    in my own. Ear aches, back aches, legs that ache or RLS.
    I began having problems in grade school, an old old school and we know the schools were full of asbestos. I had chronic ear infections, passing out spells, dizziness, sore throats and basic allergy symptoms. After leaving grade school and entering jr. high, a relatively new school, most of my medical problems seemed to occur less and less. I still had and always have had severe reactions to skin irritation such as bug bites and weeds, etc. I didn’t have near the constant headaches etc until we moved and I was again placed in a old old school. There, not only did all the other symptoms come back but I began having lower back problems. On entering high school, another nearly new school, I still had some skin irritation but the majority of the back aches etc. were again getting less.
    After marriage, I had bouts off and on the first 2 years and then got steadily better, again. The first 2 yrs my husband worked in construction on the job, after that, he was in the office. Second hand exposure to fiberglass?
    I can now go back through my life and detail every time I experienced the same symptoms and without fail, I was somehow exposed to either fiberglass or asbestos. I was a bookkeeper for various business over 25 yrs. Places I became ill again or had some new symptom included an old airplane hanger, a gravel pit and a new building where the drop ceiling hid exposed fiberglass. Finally, we built our own home. I was the clean up crew. I still had not put 2 and 2 together and all the doctors I had seen thought I was ‘nuts’ or on drugs. I was told IF there was something in my skin, it would be absorbed or kicked out. It was not! I got much much worse.
    I am a potter now and had set up my studio in our unfinished basement. After 2 yrs of working there I became more ill than ever before. I was diagnosed with TMJ, fibromyalgia, arthritis, herniated disks, allergies and the list went on and on. My health continue to fail miserably. I had 2 operations on my jaws, 2 for bladder problems and steroid injections in my jaws every year.
    My husband can be credited with coming up with the first clue as there was exposed fiberglass near my hot tub, on talking to him about how I felt, he said that couldn’t be helping. It has been a long but positive journey since. I am now feeling a little better everyday.
    I was told by someone that emu oil would help with the tmj pain. On using this oil for a couple of weeks,
    I noticed ‘something’ coming out of my skin. I now use emu oil several times a day and through trial and error, have found that applying it after a
    hot bath will flush out the some of fibers. I also mix epsom salts with the emu oil and rub this into my skin. I’ve found the pain is the worst just as the fibers are surfacing. Knowing this just makes the pain a bit easier to deal with.
    My skin feels better and better everyday and the swelling and infection caused by the fibers is greatly relieved by the use of the emu oil.
    Is it possible that these fibers are indeed asbestos and fiberglass or some other fibers in our environment? Before asbestos and fiberglass, they used ‘rock wool’. This I found is just mining slag and therefore, would include asbestos.
    I never thought I was alone as I have friends who also suffer from this but seeing the program on Primetime gave my family and those who have
    doubted what I have said, something to think about.
    I’ll watch this site and any others for more information. I’ve also found a site for “Victims of Fiberglass”
    I hope this post will at least give some people a chance at some relief if not the cure it has been for me.
    Additionally, my pets, dogs and cats have been exposed and shown reactions to fiberglass. The worst being ear infections. Emu oil works for them too.

  166. as far as fiberglass is concerned, baby powder will do a very good job of keeping it from embedding in your skin, only a respirator will keep it out of your lungs. skin problems from asbestos is highly uncommon but can happen and again its the inhaling of these fibers which cause most of the problems.

    and finally to the “Monitors” of this “house of pain”. Identities are being are becoming clear now, and I am Curious, no doubt. things are not always as they seem, isn’t that right, T/C and smiley? slam this comment as much as you like, but know that I am sure we have discussed this house before some time ago. Curious, no doubt..

  167. Thank you, Jace. I didn’t expect you to know Dr. Wymore’s private thoughts and motivations, so my questions persist for obvious reasons. In the meantime, Jace…

    Do you have any idea what the picture in this link is, with the caption, “Microscopic view of a dry, membranous-like material formed over an open skin lesion of the type associated with what a small group of people call Morgellons disease.”?

    Do you know what this same thing is, that’s pictured and described at other developmental stages of interference?

  168. Southcity,
    We’ve known who you are for a long, long, time. If you had read this blog, you would have known who we are. Get a grip!
    Tall Cotton

  169. And if I do have DOP what is the current treatment available? -Sarah Connoer

    Sarah, there are plenty of treatments available for DOP. I interned with a psychiatrist who treated DOP/Somatic mental health issues. It is basically a combo treatment of many things (medicine, therapy, excercise, nutrition, etc). Anti anxiety meds (valium, xanex, Ativan) can help you with short term anxiety while starting therapy. The next step is a combo of anti depression/anti psychotic meds. Take all pills as prescribed. The biggest reason people dont get better is not taking their meds. In therapy ask about conginitive and behaviorial therapies that can help change the way your brain thinks and behaves (trust me, you will learn a lot and realize how amazing and complicated the brain is from this). Try relaxation and meditation to help you relax, this will help you not depend on meds so much (xanex, antivan, valium, the body adjusts to these meds and have potential for abuse, all though not that often). Excercise (weight lifting, running, or even walking if the others are too hard on your body). Don’t over push yourself with the excersice either. If you do even just a little bit and feel tired, stop and rest. Remember, baby steps. Eat a good diet, lean meats, lots of veggies and fruits, keep sugar intake low, eat complex carbs, lots and lots of water (I recommend sports drinks too like gatorade and powerade that replenish your electolytes). Work hard in therapy on issues that bother you in life. Feel comfortable with your therapist and find a good one. Also, make sure that you have been tested for any physical disease or problems that could cause your symptoms, if you have had all those test before, just go a head and start therapy. A support group like family will help also. It will take time to get better and give yourself that time and you will very gradually notice improments so dont give up just because things are better in 3 months. It takes a while, and I have witness very unhealthy people with chronic DOP/Somatic illnesses get better and symptoms resolve (it is amazing!!!). Good luck and feel free to ask me any question. I want you to feel better & I am glad your are taking the steps to getting there:):):)


  170. South, please resist the invasive thoughts that Tall Cotton didn’t mean anything by, in saying, “Southcity,
    we’ve known who you are for a long, long, time.” We’re only familiar with you on the internet, and nowhere outside of that. You’ve consistently evaded anything, that we’ve ever asked, to try and help us know more about why you’re convinced that you have this thing being called “morgellons disease”. You haven’t updated anything, since saying that you and your girlfriend are in remission (or so you seem to think), and reading the terror content in all of your writings only reveals a thing of certainty. If you could only answer our relevant questions, it would assist everyone in knowing more of what you and your girlfriend are going through. What is the problem that you have with us, if not as Tall Cotton & Smileykins, but as Bugs Alive & Adapted? I like resolving issues of conflict, but I need to know what those conflicts are, first. This isn’t the proper venue for it, and I have directed you to our blog on previous occassions, here, as well as elsewhere. Please go there and list your grievances. Thank you.

  171. Idahocreek, with all of your TMJ trouble, am I correct to assume that your herniated disks are in your cervical spine, and have you had an MRI?

  172. To 911 – Thank you for all that information you posted.

    Someone gave me a quick educational on DOP – I don’t think that is my problem anymore or was – doesn’t really matter anyway. My problem was thinking that I had something called ‘Morgellons Disease’.

    It has been a hard journey – I feel the psych. meds are very close to out of my system, and this has also cleared my mind and I have realised the truth, and the fantasy of ‘Morgellons (nightmare really!!).

    I am attempting to put ALL those good methods in place you suggested. Oh yes – baby steps. You know I think of that song “I get knocked down – but I get up again” – you know the one I mean, I feel like that. It is a roller coaster BUT I must try to find the positive out of the “saw tooth curve” of my recovery. My parents are my counsellors and oh boy, are they doing a great job, and are very proud of me.

    The sad thing you know – my experience with the MRF put a massive rift between me and my family. Thank goodness they are an intelligent bunch, they knew the day would come when I would begin to understand. For me – I had to do this ON MY OWN – if they had tried to tell me this time last week – that maybe the MRF was started purely because of someones own selfish needs, suppressed anger, and possible emotional/mental health issues that hadn’t been addressed, or even an underlying disease – I WOULD NOT HAVE LISTENED – NOT because I am an idiot and can’t be told – BECAUSE I had to figure it out for myself, which I think I have.

  173. To 911 – Thank you very much for going to all that trouble with your post.

    I believe I am not DOP – otherwise the “good doc” would not have taken me off the meds and said I was a misdiagnosis of psych. some years ago. It is upsetting that I have been misdiagnosed over the years, but it has to happen to someone I guess. Feel much better off the meds, I think I could have a touch of the serotonin syndrome, but that will right its self with time. I am not upset with my shrink for giving me those pills, because they really got me through a bad time of suffering, and he didn’t hold my mouth open and push them in did he!!!

    London!!!! Get back in your box girl – you very funny lady – ok I will let you make fun of my anxious movements, in fact I think some of my anxious rantings are very amusing, they make ME laugh.

  174. Michael if I may just impose here and pass this little message to smiley and tc, thanks.

    Oh by the way Smiley & TC – I finally found out how to put a comment on your blog site!!! How long has that taken me hey!! I am just starting to figure out these blog sites you know. I will leave a message on your site later ok, because I would like to ask you a couple of things you know about blogging my story etc, thats if you can help me out – ie. I want to tell the TRUTH but don’t what to upset anyone either, I think you kinda understand what I am saying..I know someone that understands blogs and hopefully he may be able to help me out also.

    Any how – I gotta fly – things to do, places to go, people to see – you know how it is, good old LIFE – don’t ya just love it??!!

    Where is that CRAZY Lady LONDON!!!! Only JOKING London – I think I may “love you long time” – thanks also, and STOP researching those bugs that get bigger when you add water!! Sorry I had to say that. We will chat later okay…

  175. Smileykins,
    Yes, I’ve had an mri, it showed a very mild case of disc damage however, getting the fibers and resulting infection out of my spine and back has stopped the backaches completely and I do believe it was the swelling and infection caused by the fibers that created the majority of the pain. Of course this only after nearly 3 yrs of having the stuff come out of my skin from the top of my head to my toes.
    The tmj pain has also nearly gone away although with all the damage in there, it will no doubt be something I just live with. Still, any improvement is a plus. I was nearly bed ridden before I discovered emu oil.
    I believe fermaldahyde coatings on nearly everything we buy adds to all of this. Additionally, these fibers float around collecting all kinds of grime and pollen/grit/smoke/smog. Is it any wonder they cause infection?
    The only doctor I’ve had that would even consider what I said is my Facial surgeon and he is a true healer. He spent an hour pulling fibers out of my elbow after I had a bad fall. He and my dentist have seen the massive improvement in my jaw and teeth and I’ve not had to have steroid injections in over 2 years! YIPEE, those were MISERABLE
    Again, I can only assume, based on what has happened to me, what caused my illness but I do know what has made me heal and that is the ultimate goal.
    Well, that and getting folks to realize we are killing our children with new houses offgassing and the fiberglass floating around, getting stepped on and crushed and then floating a bit more. With OSB being 50% glue (fermaldahyde), fiberglass insulation, tyvec and vinyl siding, the offgassing has only one place to go, indoors. I’m not sure what the effects of fermaldahyde on skin is but I’d bet it is part of all the problems I’ve had. I wonder what a survey of ailments in folks living in these new houses might show? I’m glad to say, my home has a minimum of OSB, although the plywood has some glue too, and no tyvec or vinyl so the offgassing took a little less time. We also built our home to ‘breath’ as my husband has been involved in a ‘sick building’ before.
    Man, a person can go on and on once you’ve found someone to actually listen! It has all just been so logical.
    Back to the original question, in all my x-rays and the mri, ‘shadows’ the doctors did not have any explanation for, showed up. I wonder if those shadows would be gone now?

  176. Well, it’s sure good to hear you’ve improved so much, Idahocreek!! I know steroids are necessary, sometimes, but how wonderful to be free of those dreadful side effects. It sounds like you’re pretty well detoxified now. We sure are exposed to formaldehyde, galore, in so many things. It’s in permanent press clothing, too, but in recent years, a few clothing manufacturers have stopped using it. And, thank goodness you discovered that emu oil, huh?

  177. Proof of an indication that sheep in India sometimes die after eating Bt cotton plants for a while?

    “Proof” that is quite debatable:
    And what does this have to do with “Morgellons”?

  178. Thanks, Michael, for shedding some light on this.

  179. Smiley – Are you guys familiar with emu oil in the states??

    Should I give it a go? – the derm I went to see told me to buy menthol 1% with aqueos, what do you think?

    Michael – I know we are not supposed to talk about treatment remedies but I was just curious.

    I have finished the bottles of menthol and I am due to buy more stuff for my skin – don’t want to waste my money on unneccessary crap. thanx

  180. SarachConnor, you can discuss whatever you like. But really your dermatologist is best qualified to recommend what you put on your skin. If you want to ask someone for a second opinion, you should ask another doctor. Nobody here has any real idea as to what is going on with your skin.

    How confident do you feel about your dermatologist? Are they prone to recommending controversial remedies, like homeopathics?

  181. Michael – DON’T ask questions like that you make my hair stand on end. I KNOW NO one has an idea about what is going on with my skin.

    The Derm was a nice man, that is all I can say. Only saw him once coz my doc sent me to him.

    Homeopathics – derm didn’t mention this, but my doc is into that stuff. I think its ok, personal choice really.

  182. How confident do I feel about Dermatologists? After that citech roll thing test patch on my left cheek – NO THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Oh get this for a bit a dirt – After that procedure I became very much sicker. I forgot to pay his bill. I then had to pay the bill through a solicitor. My dad had to take over for me in the end, because they were just making me feel worse – stressing me out. The solicitor was useless, I think her name was Mrs curry or something a long indian name. Sounded like she worked out of her shed!!

  183. Homeopathic doctors are nice, since they spend a lot of time discussing your conditions. But homeopathic medicines simply have never been shown to work.

    A lot of people take homeopathic medicine without understanding what the remedies are made from. Do you think that a bit of fetid rabbit liver and heart, diluted in water a gajillion times more than there are atoms in the universe will help cure flu? Well, that’s the “best” homeopathic medicine there is.

    I don’t want to worry you, but from what I’ve heard, your doc sounds somewhat shonky.

  184. Michael – Ding Dong!! I had a LOOK at that document – I only got as far as the first paragraph.

    My doc WOULD NOT let me have the flu shot – he said that in his experience of treating chronic rickettsiosis the flu shot has been found to make people much much worse for months afterwards.

    I have had the flu shot before – but because I was so brain dead last year I couldn’t say whether it was the flu shot, the illness or just everyone pissing in my pocket.

    Funny though – my grans doc gave her the flu shot and the pneumonia shot, that same doc actually turned down taking on treating me. The Psych Hospital I was in phoned him and asked, since he used to treat our family occasionally years ago when our doc was on holidays or anything like that. He said my case was to complicated.


    If you listen to the chemical industry’s public relations campaigns, you’d think that all of its products are perfectly safe — and that environmental and public health advocates who criticize those products are biased, misguided, or even self-serving.
    The industry’s own documents tell a different story.

    For decades, the chemical industry has known all too well that some of its products pose risks, both acute and chronic, to human health — including cancer, endocrine disruption, liver damage, and other serious health problems. Worse, the industry’s documents show that chemical companies have gone to great lengths to conceal these dangers from its workers, consumers, and from the public at large.

    This website draws from an extensive collection of the chemical industry’s own internal documents, which were obtained through lawsuits brought by citizens who alleged that they were harmed by the products of chemical companies — or by the family members who survive them. These documents point to a damning conclusion: that the chemical industry has known for decades that its products were dangerous, and did not inform the public of the potentially devastating health effects.

  186. Systemic, diseases and medical conditions can arise for all kinds of reasons. If your accusations about the chemical industry and the bio-engineering industries are entirely true, then it makes the world a less healthy place, with greater potential for illness.

    However, what does this have to do with demonstrating that Morgellons is a distinct disease that produces fibers, itching and lesions? All you are doing is making some claims, that, if true, make it more likely for people to be sick.

    What does this have to do with Morgellons?

    Michaeltte said in relation to admissions of chemical industry.



    As an old programmer you should know enough BASIC language to use an “if then” statement. Come on Michael, you are smarter than this and so are some of the people that visit here.

  188. IF ((The environment is messed up) AND (GMOs are on the loose)) THEN (Morgellons is real)

    Computers generally deal in predicate logic, binary possibilities. It’s a mistake to take a multivariate, underspecified, fuzzy problem, and try to apply boolean logic to it.

  189. while my girlfriend and my own symptoms have lessened considerably, we are both still very much aware of its persistance. these are fairly well stated on the initial case def. written by wymore. I quickly put this small video together to place some images with the words. observations.wmv


    I might mention that I have received the same stories and images from dozens of people both in the states as well from overseas. watch the video, and ill wager you will be more cautious next time someone simply goes to shake your hand.. Also, if you think its a trick I show in this video, email me you’re mailing address and ill send you samples for you to repeat this yourselves.. sure upset my Dr. when he was unable to ID.

  190. South,

    Your specks are moving because of surface tension. If you scraped it from your skin or under your fingernails, it probably had a tiny speck of soap mixed in on one side. The uneven disruption of the surface tension of the water causes it to move like that.

    Here’s an explanation, with video:

    And lots of other examples:

  191. Yes, Michaelllo(n$),

    Agree binary 0 or 1. data statement should contain other possibilities but morgellons should be included.

    101 for i=1 to 1000:read n$(i):? n$(i):next I

  192. not the case at all. often when a sudden itch happens, once you scratch your nails will have become blackened by whatever this stuff is. surface tension-jeez you guys are too much

  193. also, soap is used to clean my nails after they get this way, I am open to explaination but soap is not an acceptable one.

  194. So, you use soap to clean your nails, but you can’t accept that when your nails are dirty, they might still have a speck of soap under them?

    When you bath, you use soap, some of it invariably remain on your skin, when you scratch, the collected dermal debris will include some soap.

  195. error: (101) undefined variable “I”

  196. just wrote an example sub routine. was not going to write the whole program….notice it began on 101. Butt, you get the message. If the field of view is too narrow you miss what is on the fringe. Speaking of which, do you have your hotel reservations for the Morg Jam infestival, or do you have reservations?

  197. Just a snip earlier.

    here is another one.

    NEW Conclusions:

    The nematode I believe is an enteropathogenic biocontrol species which has been genetically modified to be of very small size. The Steinernema riobravis is one genetically modified species used today in the USA for cotton. Many species are used already all over our country as well as the world. The way it works is: agriculturalists (since the late 80s) release millions of these tiny biocontrol worms into the soil of crops (in particular citrus, cotton and corn), into golf course turfs, gardens, etc., etc. to parasitize and kill off other “pest” insects. Unfortunately, there is no guarantee that these nematodes would stop at insects, when warm-blooded hosts may be readily available. (There are absolutely NO controls by our government regulating either the testing, distribution or application of these creatures!) The worms each contain a unique type of bacterium (which they themselves are immune to, and this bacteria has been genetically “enhanced” to make them more lethal) and is the deadly element released once the worm invades the larger insect host. The bacterium could explain the bizarre formation of fibers and other amorphisms in the skin of the host. Obviously the clothing or textile (raw cotton or processed cloth) is not being sanitized and getting into garments which are distributed through our country (USA). In Columbia, they treat crops with dioxin, and some crops have been exposed to paraquat via the drug cartel wars which may have modified the organism. And many clothing manufacturers use Columbia for a source of cotton. And numerous other chemical treatments are used on crops there. Also many third world countries lack the stringent sterilizing elements found in the US methods. Enteropathogenic nematodes are used by ALL countries that produce cotton.

    However the shape of this parasite appears more like the filarial Nematode species. This has to be a cross between several species… it behaves like a silk worm, and demonstrates Scabies or spider like tendencies.. and it is producing some chemical particles from my skin and hair… also there is a bacterial element and that bacterial could be genetically altered bacteria which works with the nematode, as they do have symbiotic relationships

    It is possible that the primary damage or core of this disease is bacterial, although I do not believe it is Lymes disease, as is sometimes supposed. Obviously, if bacterial, then the vector of it becomes secondary in
    importance. In this case, a microscopic nematode, which may itself have been vectored by a small species of screw worm fly found throughout our the Midwest and Eastern coast. One or more of these insects carried with it a new form of genetically modified, heat-resistant bacteria, capable of producing fiber. Please don’t misunderstand, I am not suggesting that this is bio-terrorism. On the contrary, that these types of bacterial strains may have been produced with our own government’s consent and even involvement for the purposes of research and development.

    Second, the bacteria involved in this disease do not consist of one but multiple strains, depending on their source of origin. Thus, while all those experiencing this disease present with certain symptoms which are
    common to all, many individuals manifest symptom variations which are quite different from those of others. There exists such a diversity in the commonality, because the bacteria that one person or group received are
    slightly different from the bacteria another received, although they are designed to produce similar end results.

    Third, the bacterial strains have been engineered for the purposes of creating raw materials biologically, especially fibers which will be used in creating new textile markets. These bacteria have been extensively
    engineered and tested over the last ten years by a plethora of companies (DuPont, Honywell, Nexia, etc.) including the U.S. Army, using both plant and mammal tissue as a medium to verify their ability to produce these materials. Many failures were reported and the inadequate bacterial strains were “discarded.”

    Fourth, these bacterial strains have been disposed of indiscriminately, with improper safety protocols, much as were the many toxic wastes of the last generation’s industries. This is because there are no effective safety
    measures in place within our government or any others (of which we are aware). Instead, the public is told that these types of research and products are absolutely environmentally friendly, since they are not “toxic” but purely biological. It is alarming to think how easily the mutant bacterial strains could spread to different vectors once outside the laboratory. NOTE: I am not implying that such leakage would be intentional, but merely accidental based on lax protocols.

    Finally, the bacteria which produce fibers can do so inside the skin as well as outside it, as long as there are available proteins for it to use. The “fiber balls” that are seen so often with the disease are in fact
    produced by the bacteria (not nematodes, or any other invertebrate species), using the proteins from skin, hair, cloth, etc. The bacteria themselves are quite infective, being able to invade the skin, and are felt as “itchy, stinging” sensations on the skin when they enter. When they are multiplying and (often) rapidly producing fibers, they can be felt as “tingling” or “crawling” sensations, on or under the skin.

    an interesting note.

  198. OMG!! Wake up Occam. Get him out here.

  199. “Infestival” HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

  200. Systemic, you are looking for the cause of something before you have determined if it exists. What evidence do you have that lots of people are suffering from the same disease, one that creates fibers, itching and lesions?

    It’s quite possible that aliens are re-wiring our DNA via mediated emergent protein folding combinatorics, with side effects of extruded fibers which are the sloughed prion skeletal assembly frameworks. All things are possible, but you’ve got to give us some evidence that Morgellons IS real, not evidence that it’s possible.

  201. Oh, Systemic. South, your video was too revealing. I’m sorry to say this, but I’m sure I would be rather startled, and in search of the right words to say to a patient, if I were a doctor too. I doubt they very often encounter someone concerned over what happens from indequate bathing, basically. Put on the spot, one would have to be at a loss to say much of anything, I would imagine. I’m not saying you don’t bathe often enough, but you are more than adequately spelling out what’s going on with you, yourself, South. Did you not ever scrape that gunk when you were running and playing, as a sweaty little kid, once upon a time, years ago? You missed out, if you didn’t. You missed out if you didn’t play with microscopes, as a child, too.

    When skin secretions build up (oil & sweat, comprising our acid mantle), and the debris from dead, and dying cells, as well as small things, such as specks & fibers, from our normal, everyday, environment catches inside of it, and it isn’t removed, you can expect to scrape it off. It’s doing its job, but you have to regularly, and gently, exfoliate it. If you just bathe without doing that, you’ll have an invisible layer of gunk, with all sorts of junk, and germs in it!

    Don’t you see how morgie people say such things as, “as I was bathing/showering”, and/or, “as I was toweling off”, and/or “as I applied lotion”? That surface film becomes slicky when water saturates it, and real gummy when soap contacts it, and it will loosen up, and ball up, and be difficult to remove. Fibers, and specks, that you didn’t even know were glued down in that layer will be apparent. It’s the same stuff that mixes with soap, to form soap scum, in ring-around-the-bathtub. Friction, produced during bathing, or applying lotions, makes the fibers that are stuck within that layer, roll up into little fiber balls.

    Skin can’t just be taken for granted. It has to be cleansed well, and taken care of, so it can breathe! Even if you don’t have allergies, or any other problems, that can make you itch, and be susceptible, then, to infections. You don’t know it, and I-know-you-would-never-believe-it, but you can have a buildup of carbon dioxide in your bloodstream, from low oxygen levels, if your skin is THAT suffocated from buildup! We have to have adequate life sustaining oxygen levels in our blood for healthy cellular functions, including healing. Without that gas exchange being able to occur, people whose skin is that sluggish, are toxic, *literally*, and feeling full of aches and pains. Of course, they’re lethargic. But, no, you don’t understand that, and you’re not alone.. Also, wounds, and the skin around them, form new capillaries through a process called angiogenesis, that sprout and branch out new little vessels, in an effort to bring more oxygen (red blood cells), to wounds so that they can heal.

    You really feel convinced that your fear is worth holding onto, due to an unfounded belief that you will be compensated for it. Well, I guarantee you that it isn’t true, because there is absolutely nothing complicated going on here. Except, to you, there is. You’re very confused and completley mistaken. I know that morgie people can not help this, though. All of you are consumed in fear, some, worse than others. You do a fantastic job with making them worse, too, South, thinking you’re helping to warn people of things that are a major concern to you. Morgie people are outrageously easily influenced into all the wrong directions. That’s what got you all involved in this big mess to start with. Just like Mary Leitao, all of these unscrupulous, medically-minded, people who are pretending to be on your side, too, are fueling this myth of “morgellons disease” and doing a royal number on patients, such as yourself.

    And don’t I just know it, all-too-well, that you will take my straight-from-the-heart message, working in unison with a fairly well functioning brain, with no malicious intent whatsoever, and be even MORE thoroughly convinced that I’m working as part of the coverup. South, this is sadder than sad, and I know you cannot help it.|479659033

  202. You are right.
    My Doc says that due to Hurricane Katrina and the Stress that this event has caused; has placed me in a vulnerable, delusional state.
    Please forgive me all for my posts as I am now recieving proper medical care.

  203. I think that Katrina would stress anyone out. I’m glad to hear that you are receiving the proper care.

  204. I am glad someone is receiving proper care because I haven’t.

    I am so angry that my doctor believed Mary. No one can blame me, don’t shot the messenger.

    I am a Victim remember that pleaase.

    He said he believes there is an infectious agent involved in what I have, so I do not know what to make of that statement.

    Why the hell should I continue to give him information about my illness, he has not taken notice of my real pain and suffering, if he had I would have had more tests.

    Maybe if he had done a physical examination on my first appointment with him July 2005 he may have a better idea. If he had of believed me on my first visit that I look nothing like I should, maybe I would not feel like I am dying.

    Then you get idiots involved in this that say “Morgellons Disease mimics everything” well yes is does in a sense, controlling etc they did that to me. But how can a persons mind tell them something. I can not figure this out. I felt this way back in Jan 2005 like I was dying, then that thought went, I found my current doctor, had the IV infusions and the feeling and thoughts of dying came again during my last IV’s.

    I told my doctor if you are trying to get an idea of the herx reactin taking me close to death, well you have managed that. I don’t want to ever feel like this again. The most horrible experience I have had and still is.

    Do you really think this is fair on me? I have never known such cruelity in my entire life. I just exist at the moment. Nothing is making my suffering go away. I was hoping my blogging on here would help someone listen to me. I hope they are and I hope they will move in this like their arse is on fire.

  205. Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever
    Lyme Disease

    Either one, alone, is enough to cause the symptoms you have. I wish I were in Australia to help you, Sarach.

  206. I am fucked I think – I phoned the CDC – told them my health department won’t help me. I tried to get into a doctor today the one my pharmacist put me onto. He has closed the surgery – wholistic medicine. The surgery will reopen after Sept 7 and only selling wholistic medicine. I need a hospital, or a doctor and I am too scared to know what to do.

  207. I think the only cure seems to be death, and that is fucked. Why must I be put in a position of committing suicide. This is so so so unfair.

  208. I am not with the NMO either, I want too get well – not play with the media.

  209. Marginal said:


    margalien, you have been reading some more of cliff “ufonmo” mickelson’s “breaking news alerts.” In case you haven’t figured it out yet, tinfoil cliffy writes to the best of his imagination. Try reading some non-fiction for a change.

  210. Sarach, of course, this is hard to do all these continents apart, and especially, not even knowing the details.
    On my gut feeling, if I were there with you, I would go to an emergency room, tell them you have rickettsiosis from the RMSF group, and request a spinal tap. Can you do that?

  211. Of course, tell them you recently found out you have lyme disease too, and that you have been very ill.

  212. Texastar, I previously posted this about Cliff:

    # Smileykins Says:
    August 1st, 2006 at 12:16 pm

    Long ago, when I partcipated in lymebuster’s message board and first saw the guy’s name and tried to dissuade morgie people from visiting the link he’d provided, I’d concluded some things about him. Apparently, I may have been wrong, and he is the-way-he-is due to another factor I’d been unaware of, at the time, until recently.

    Based on that link, with his claimimg that some morgie people have to use stimulants to obtain energy to fight “morgellons disease”, but that the drawback is, that it makes the “morgellons disease” get worse, says it ALL, for him. Poor man.

  213. In actuality, Michael was only saying that in an effort to reason with Systemic.
    Hopefully, Systemic can be able, now, as they claimed yesterday, to try hard to find the ways of working towards coming to terms with so many things, just a little bit better, as they mentioned in comment # 206.

  214. Please refer to my comment, #205, yesterday, and note some of the content from one of Jace’s, in comment #54.

    jace Says:
    August 23rd, 2006 at 7:16 am

    Hi Smiley- Please don’t think I’m ignorant, but I have no idea what you’re asking me. Does it matter whether it’s industrial, organic or environmental? My point is that all of these common sources of “fibers” would be in the FBI database, because all the ones you (and I) have named are common and would show up as such. As for the patient’s skin- it was completely unbroken in that area, the physician had to scrape the epidermis away to grab the fibers. I was the one holding the dermatoscope which magnifies the area and you could see that there was no disturbance of the skin anywhere around the fiber.

    Naturally, I know that Jace is innocent of her involvement in this. I didn’t even ask for this comment though, and I don’t think it was necessary to say it, in reference to my commnent #137.

    #167 jace Says:
    August 25th, 2006 at 5:35 am

    Hi again Smiley-

    I believe that is the exact reason that Dr Wymore has taken on this “cause”. He saw that there were people (all the above named, plus the multiple snake oil sellers) that were taking advantage of suffering people.

    My comment being referenced, had been:

    #88Smileykins Says:
    August 23rd, 2006 at 2:24 pm

    Let’s talk some about credibility and credentials. Those are two GIGANTIC issues that morgies bring up a lot. Some food for thought, just for starters, morgie people…

    Mary Leitao
    Ginger Savely
    Dr, Schwartz
    Dr. Wymore

    Well, Jace, feeling the need to comment that “you believe the exact reason” for Dr. Wymore’s “having taken on this ’cause’, was because, “he saw that there were people (all the above named, plus the multiple snake oil sellers) that were taking advantage of suffering people.”, just does not compute. Why would he have joined up with MRF, if he thought Mary Leitao and Ginger Savely were doing that? (Think. No, nevermind.)

    Later, I’d commented:

    #170 Smileykins Says:
    August 25th, 2006 at 9:43 am

    Thank you, Jace. I didn’t expect you to know Dr. Wymore’s private thoughts and motivations, so my questions persist for obvious reasons. In the meantime, Jace…

    Do you have any idea what the picture in this link is, with the caption, “Microscopic view of a dry, membranous-like material formed over an open skin lesion of the type associated with what a small group of people call Morgellons disease.”?

    Do you know what this same thing is, that’s pictured and described at other developmental stages of interference?

    I’d like to request that nobody else answer, please. I’d still like to hear your reply, Jace. I know you aren’t “the enemy” like you mentioned the other day, and I don’t see you in that light at all!!!

  215. To Emu Oil or not to ——-
    There is a great deal of information on emu oil on line as well as options to buy.
    What one does or does not try or do to relieve the symptoms is an individual decision. I believe, if a person is suffering enough, nothing is beyond at least a try, unless of course it’s toxic. I know one gal that thinks she has bugs, she has nearly poisoned herself taking things to include wormer for horses! To me, it’s just a little bottle of oil so I tried it. It worked!
    I went to doctors for over 10 years, this included GP’s, dermatologists, facial surgeons, chiropractors, naturopaths and one doc suggested I contact environmental medical pros. Their response, all 3 of those in this area was ‘if you didn’t get hurt at work, what do you want us to do?” which told me they were after insurance claims, NOT helping cure anyone. Most want to put me on antibiotics which I generally am allergic to. I was desperate for some relief from the pain that didn’t include pain pills that knocked me even further down both emotionally and physically.
    I believe after nearly 3 yrs of exfoliation, emu oil and lots of hot baths/showers and my hot tub twice a day, I am nearly well. The problem now is staying well. Since the ‘fibers’ are everywhere it’s hard to know what to do. I did some research and found dimethicone is effective in protecting the skin. It is also said to attach to the dead skin cells and seems to help in getting the fibers out. It’s found in several skin products.
    Yep, I’ve done the baby powder thing to and when I’m going shopping or out in public, I generally wear it as I’ve found new stores bother me a great
    I know I’m really new here and I haven’t read every post, no do I have the time. My objective in writing was to first express my delight in finding you and second to maybe help someone else find some relief.
    I believe for the most part, folks just don’t want to know what is happening, it’s too scary. We’ve dealt with so much contamination of this planet that one more thing just tips the powers to be over.
    As for if asbestos and fiberglass are harder on the lungs or skin, I don’t pretend to be an expert, I simply know what has happened to me. The fibers in my skin caused swelling, this swelling pushed on every cell in my body, it effected my breathing as the pressure reduced that breathing. On getting the infection out of my neck, chest, breasts and rib area, I can not only breath again, my singing voice has returned, I no longer cough and hack every morning and my energy level is going up every day.
    My ONLY reason for writing was to offer my experience in hopes that others might also find some relief.
    Since my last round of exposure to fiberglass, earlier this year, my hands swelled up so bad I haven’t been able to use them without gloves for months. I finally bought some New Skin and covered my hand. To my amazement, the next morning, under the product was horrible black “stuff”. On peeling off the liquid bandage and the black, puss then came out of the pores on my hands. i didn’t believe it, did it again and yep, same thing. I believe this is crushed fiberglass *shrugs* but who knows.
    The last time I had my eyes checked, the optomitrist had me tilt my head sideways and looked at my skin thru his 600 power machine. He was stunned! He could visibly see the fiberglass in my face.
    And now, my hands are feeling so much better, off to my beloved pottery where I will play in the clay all day!
    This itself is the joy of finding relief! MY life back!
    It’s just a little bottle of oil ;)

  216. Idahocreek Says:
    August 29th, 2006 at 9:43 am
    I believe after nearly 3 yrs of exfoliation, emu oil and lots of hot baths/showers and my hot tub twice a day, I am nearly well. The problem now is staying well. Since the ‘fibers’ are everywhere it’s hard to know what to do.

    BRAVO!!! Regular, gentle exfoliation is madatary for people who have various causes for slow skin cell turnover rate. I never have been able to get a morgie to want to understand that, but you have the key to the whole “morgellons disease” fiber mystery too. YAY!!!

  217. BRAVO!!! Regular, gentle exfoliation is madatary for people who have various causes for slow skin cell turnover rate.

    It’s also a good idea for ANYONE, I personally credit exfoliation for minimizing scar tissue on my face – over time, of course.

  218. Smiley- I’m going to have to stop posting on this blog due to “conflict of interest” I wish only the best for everyone here.

  219. Jace, ML finally get to you and wymore

  220. Well folks I am not going to post on this blog anymore either. This journey has been way too painful for me and I can not go on anymore. I have to do what is right for me. I know I am very sick anyway and just want it to end, and I will end it for me the way I see fit. I wish everyone well, love you to all and take care. Maybe see you some other day in nicer places.

  221. Thanks! Finally, someone who sees and understands!
    On ex-fol… I have always done this but more vigorously the past 3 yrs.
    One more thing I neglected to mention. A side benefit of getting all this infection out, I’ve changed clothing sizes, down 2 from where I started and from yearly checkup to yearly checkup only lost 4 lbs. It was all infection in my skin.
    I don’t know if I have it all figured out but I know I have the same fibers as I’ve seen here, red, black,and shiny, long and short. To my way of thinking, if it won’t shave or bleach, it’s certainly not hair.
    I do know I feel better and therefore will continue with what has works.
    From what I’ve been told, there is no test for rock or glass. Doesn’t glass turn florescent under a black light?
    If asbestos can enter the lungs, why would it not also enter the skin? Or anything else that would enter the lungs. I know the big push is the lung cancer, I simply do not understand thinking it can’t enter the skin as well. Seems logical to me. As with hormones/nicotine patches, osmosis would do it.
    Oh well, I’ve had all the discussion on this with people face to face that I care to.
    Best wishes and healing to you all. May the Great Spirit smile on you and make you glad. :D
    and thanks for the kudos;) I needed it!

  222. Are these fibers really just filarial (or other parasitic) worms? Have I missed this discussion? (Just see to get grossed out as to how bad it ‘could be’ if one got the wrong parasite). I’m a 3rd generation victim, yet the hairs have been so minor aa part that they have been ignored *(yet under the right conditions they ‘bite’).* Also, don’t whipworms, thread(strongy)worms, etc. exit the skin in hyperinfections? (they certainly enter to cause an infection…

    Methyl salicylate (Oil of wintergreen) TOPICAL-DROPWISE-DAILY- I have found to generally heal skin lesions.
    ***DANGER TOXIC in mL quantity-READ MSDS*** OR

  223. Burn, PhD, I’m sorry that you and your family believe you’re parasitized. This blog is an informative, educational tool about what’s behind “morgellons disease”. Please read all that you can here. The message is one of hope, to assist those who are able to be receptive to the truth, so that they can make wise decisions regarding their health care, and the health care of their loved ones.

  224. Well, that nicely illustrate the dangers of home remedies and self-diagnosis. Perhaps you should ask a doctor what would be best for your lesions.

    Here’s a better MSDS link for Methyl Salicylate:

    May be fatal if inhaled, swallowed or absorbed thru the skin Avoid all contact. Use with adequate ventilation. Wash thoroughly after use. Keep container closed.
    VAPORS ARE HAZARDOUS!! Eyes/skin:wash affected area for at least 15 min with large amounts of water. Inhal: remove person to fresh air give cpr/oxygen if needed.ingest: wash out mouth with large amounts of water providing person is conscious. In all cases seek medical attention. Conditions aggravated/target organs.persons with pre-existing or respiratory conditions may be more susceptible.

    Of course, that’s for the strong stuff. But PhD did not specify. You’d probably want to use 2%

    Ask your doctor if salicylic acid is right for you.

  225. I’ve always been appalled at the reports stating that people who think that they have “morgellons disease” have been ignored by their doctors and forced into self-diagnosing, as well as self-treating, over the internet. That is so profoundly perverse, and so incorrect. What do we most often find such patients associating with it, and self-diagnosing with, and thinking that they’re “treating” for? It’s reported that the majority of such patients refused, and ignored, their doctors’ diagnoses, with a deep-seated belief that doctors are either stupid, lazy, or part of a conspiracy. It would be great if people knew their doctors weren’t their enemies. But, it would be great, if such patients were able to, then, avail themselves of all the wonderful resources the web has to offer, and use them as a tool to help them go back and communicate with doctors. They have tunnel vision, though, and rather than searching their symptoms, they dwell on searching one thing. They search what they can’t help focusing on, and it’s so sad.

  226. I don’t mean to sound insensitive. It isn’t easy to accept that people are in such situations as they are, and it’s very difficult to try understanding the thought processing involved. The suspicion, that some people have, for instance, that a government conspiracy is to blame for what is wrong with them, is particularly troubling. Given that fact, how is it that such people can simultaneously be looking to their government for help over it? All the complaining that somebody had better come forth and admit what they’ve done and take care of everyone, makes one realize just how bad it is for some people. They desperately need help, and, yet, it’s help that they’re unable to realize for themselves.


    Michael – This link is about Rife Machines. I received an email telling me that this could possibly be the treatment for Morgellons. I am unable to read stuff today and retain the information. Yes in other words I am confused!!

    Could you please explain Rife Machines to me in laymans terms and how this would relate to treating Morgellons Disease. Thanks.

  228. It seems that the basic principle of the original beam was to send out the right frequencies to render certain cells useless.
    You know how a microwave works?
    in laymans terms frequencies make the water (and others but less so)molecules vibrate and generate heat.

    Also think of the singer hitting the resonance frequency for, and shattering, crystal.

    The new thing thats come out of russia purports to build on that, but the only thing i could find on it was on so.. google his name and you will find it there.

    The thing is ofcourse that to find the destructive resonance frequency and energy you need to know what you are targetting, and it needs to not share its resonance freq with other desirable cells. according to rense its undergoing trials in georgia for treating hep-c


  229. check makes alot more sense now.

  230. There is only one article i could find on the latest round of rife tech. its the same one reproduced on rense credited to
    Ken Welch

    so 7 years old and hep-c is still among us, so either its a hoax or impractical or a coverup =)
    should you find out more please let me know

  231. Eureka, checking your state of mind makes sense to the rest of the general public. Tam’s scammin’ ya, but seems to have a severe problem himself.

  232. eureka, those videos are not made to prove anything, they are gimmicky and seem to be running some kind of hypnosis track, whats the point of all those noises? sounds disturbingly like Hypno-Peripheral Processing and/or Hemi-sync.
    I would think there would be better ways of disseminating information than passing on overproduced and undersourced vids.?

  233. OK so you got better info? Your right, they are not trying to prove anything. Just document a condition. It looks exactly like what I observed under a microscope. I think there would be a better way to find an answer than arguing the point with you. Have you observed any of this under a microscope. Looks like TMJC developed a new identity to me. Its all over the place now and you cant do anything about it . HAHAHAHA

  234. There is a serious underlying reason behind this site. Check your pc. They decided to change their screen names for a reason.

  235. Hey Smiley-

    Bite me puss-bone. Get a cause to help people.

  236. and a little 7 year mental patient will reply with ???

  237. Norman, I mean, Debunker2, under the latest topic entitled, “Hystorical Context”, see where it says…

    A quote within the above mentioned Extraordinary Popular delusions and the Madness of Crowds is of twisted relevance. Back in the late 1700s, the use of microscopes was causing problems:

    Oh that I had remained in that happy state of ignorance wherein you first found me! Yet will I confess that, as my knowledge increased, so did my pleasure, until I beheld the last wonders of the microscope; from that moment I have been tormented by doubt and perplexed by mystery: my mind, overwhelmed by chaotic confusion, knows not where to rest, nor how to extricate itself from such a maze. I am miserable, and must continue to be so, until I enter on another stage of existence.

    Does that remind you of anyone?

    Had you never, before,looked through the lens of a microscope until whenever you did concerning “morgellons disease”?

    Oh yeah, there’s a serious reason behind this site, and it’s sad that nobody realized there was a need to speak against “morgellons disease” way back at the start.

  238. Ha-

    Look at all the Universities visiting silent superbug. com. It is scary.

  239. Looked through alot of microscopes. Looking at this site is macro and the results are this site is silly.

  240. A need to speak against Morgellons shows a prejudice against the fact. Wonder what your motivation is.

  241. “A quote within the above mentioned Extraordinary Popular delusions and the Madness of Crowds is of twisted”

    Does this make sense to anyone?

    Got to get a smiley out of that reasoning.

  242. Sorry Boy-

    there is a new website in town and it makes this irrevlant.

  243. My personal opinion is that Michael, Tallcotton and Smilyekins are individual people.

    My opinion on the purpose of this website – Dan Rutz was quoted to say the word “debunk” and “Morgellons Disease” in a newspaper article. I believe Michael is a retired computer programmer (wearing a cap with “CIA” printed on it!!!joke) hired by the Government. This way the public are once again doing the work for the Government.

    It is nothing new that society is “used” by the Government, it has been happening for centuries. The difference with Morgellons is that this group of people are severely ill and dying. If the CDC keep the public waiting any longer I would hate to imagine what some desperate people might do.

    After the lies and cover up over the death of JFK no wonder guns are still legal in the USA. In my research of Morgellons I have heard the word ‘gun’, ‘shoot’, government and morgellons all in the one paragraph. People are anger, very very angry and rightly so.

  244. GO SARAH

  245. Eureka Says:
    September 20th, 2006 at 11:10 pm
    Sorry Boy-

    there is a new website in town and it makes this irrevlant.

    Which website would that be?

    I do hope you are not referring to the “Morgellons Group” website by Cliff Mickelson.

    This man could not possibly be suffering from this disease. How do I know this? Because I have this disease. If he actually has this he has the very early stages.

    Cliff is fixated on the nematode and the cotton. I am not discrediting his theories or research in anyway, I believe he speaks a lot of truth with regards to the cotton. I just don’t think he really cuts it in the area of support, my opinion here. Nice guy to talk to, spoke to him once on the phone. I just don’t think his website is for Morgellons sufferers support in anyway, I feel it is merely to polish his ego, and very sick people like me get caught in the cross fire of website ‘mind games’.

  246. Eureka Says:
    September 20th, 2006 at 11:06 pm

    This the best proof yet.

    I have seen pieces of both videos. My friend watched the first video in full length some time ago, and said “that guy is weird”. Not bad videos really. I am not a scientist so can’t give a scientific theory, but I will give you a laymans theory.

    Michael Crichton wrote the Andromeda Strain, a movie was also made by the same name back in the 60′s I think. I believe experiments gone wrong in laboratories have leaked into society for years. Hilter was a perfect example of that.

    I have never read the Andromeda Strain or the Prey, only read the blurbs which was enough for me. When I experienced paranoia for the first time recently after taking Flagyl my Dad instructed me to read both books, he said “the brain needs to absorb them”. I would bet any woman who has Morgellons has at some stage experienced being “The Prey”. It is the most frightening paranoia I have ever experienced. The last time I experienced this was last weekend, why? Stress basically, my doctors appointment on the Friday and the realisation of my predictions of this disease which have so far come true. And then the MSBP which is also coming to light. I was not physically abused as a child. My mum suffered a lot of emotional abuse from her mother and she never dealt with this.

    To be able to stay level headed I can not speak to my sister, mum or grandma. Why you ask?? Because they are caught up in the “Delusion” the delusion that the whole of society is suffering from including doctors.

    MSBP works on an energy and genetic level for me. I was always the little girl that attracted the eye of strangers. “Isn’t she just beautiful” people would say to my mum. But then my mum would thrust my sister forward and say, “but so is she”. Mum explained she did this because she didn’t want my sister to feel inferior in anyway.

    My mum and my gran will both tell anyone that they are nothing alike. Funny thing is though – they are. They just show it different ways.

    My Gran is as fit as a fiddle at 90, but has always had an appetite like she has parasites, obsessed with food, loves it. Eats very healthy though. I believe she will live until she is a 100 or more, purely because she has always been selfish and self consumed. My dad said when she dies he wants that “mirror” of hers that she always looks into. She does not believe her hair is grew, nor can she see that her osteoporosis is that bad that her head can nearly touches the floor. She has no dementia, but does have COAD, a hiatus hernia and Rheumatoid Arthritis just to name a few. My Great Great Gran had such severe Rheumatoid Arthritis it deformed all her limbs, her legs had to be broken to be able to fit her body in the coffin.

    My mum has and still does use my dads cancer like a weapon against me should I ever pull her up when she is controlling towards me. She runs around after my Gran and so does my dad because he has no choice, he is married to my mum. He is loyal, too loyal to the point where it just worsens his cancer. I was 14 when my dad was diagnosed with cancer, oh yes indeed was that a life changing experience. My parents and sister could not be any healthier in their daily lives, just the same as I was when I was diagnosed with fibromyalgia 10 years back.

  247. thanks for ur honest account
    try a bath with lots of epsom salts
    get some silver spoons, whatever
    boil them in milk and honey
    from cold
    add oregano oil, leaves to milk
    tea tree oil in bath
    garlic ingested, also in bath
    add boiled milk and honey AND silver to bath, make it as hot as u can stand, as deep to cover u
    immerse yourself
    this is an effective way of shifting the fibres; remember they transmit electrons
    watch as the fuzz balls materialize in the water
    its a very effective non aggressive treatment; if you are in pain like me u will soon appreciate the benefits

    silver is a transmutative element, it imparts energy
    silver is also a holy metal; remmber “all that glitters is not gold”
    boiling silver in water, or milk, imparts some charged electrons from the silver
    this cure is based on the best remedial agents against evil
    remember we are dealing with a quorum sensing electron capacitive biologically active fibre= evil
    i call it 21st century vampirism
    try the bath sarah

  248. Thanks Al – I used to live in the Salt baths you know. I get rather scared having them these days, but I know they work.

    I literally disappear in size. I will follow your advice ok, Thank you.

  249. Al, I rather fear you are serious with your silver spoon solution.

    But it’s pseudo-scientific nonsense. A “quorum sensing electron capacitive biologically active fibre” is just a bundle of words, signifying nothing.

  250. do it sarah we aussies thrive on adversity
    please understand that u need to clearly focus your mind and have active pursuits in the form of hobbies music helps
    be very aware of the greater issues
    as we have seen, this is basically right wing neo fascism
    i say NO QUARTER
    btw sarah, i commend u for ur bravery
    also a 1kg bar of silver is about 500 aussie dollars
    if u can get one n use it as a cake of soap in the bath
    u will find that it will literally adhere to anatomical organs like the spleen
    this helps shift the energy blocks in the body
    thanks margs for deigning to comment
    u sacked smellycatsclaws and tc ?
    or r they still sleepy?
    i told u ud be busy…lol
    we will win this in the spirit of our forebears
    who arent psychopathic yank bullies
    we are AUSTRALIAN

    ill just start throwing biblical texts at yas
    lets call in the HEAVY HORSES
    the long bows have all been drawn
    in the name of the father the son and the holy ghost and st peter whoo slew simon magi, i call on alll the saints, i call on all redeemed souls to cry to the lord as one in mute resolute conviction
    to bring to light the evil works of man
    now guys
    lets see ur ivory towers crumble
    i adjure the, old serpent of the deep, begone , u have been exposed as a cheat and a liar from old
    salve me Redemptor Mundi

  252. Wow Al – I wish I could understand what you are saying. Where abouts in Australia are you? Do I already know you?

  253. im in tassie
    sarah that above is an excorsism rite…
    to wake these fucktards up… to make them aware the game is up…
    how do u think u got this shit?

  254. see how quiet they are?
    i wonder; do they understand anything of the 7 hermetic laws?
    methinks they are too artful
    i reckon they’re panicking coz their structure is being rumbled
    the word of god is mightily powerful sarah
    awe inspiring
    i wonder what the response will be? tall cotton will just say im crazy
    smilykins must have a dictaphone cos her verbose outpourings are like war and peace
    she must tap into realms mere mortals wouldnt dare
    play the game of life sarah
    be a winner
    tell these dudes only what you want them to hear; not how u feel, god they know how u feel,
    be a winner
    be calm, rational, find a peace seperate from your bodily traumas and mental dispair
    your spirit and soul are seperate from your physical body, live in the peace of understanding, that , even though your suffering is great, and the doctors blithly and contempyuously hold up the mantra that we are so often exposed to here by paid idiots
    could they change a tyre?
    do they know milk comes from cattle?
    be a winner
    find your place in a realm of thought where u imagine yourself to be a fountain
    study the scene?
    is it clean and serene? or is there weeds and leaky pool in the fountain, visualize the scene in beauty and love , this is your place in heaven, and god is honorouble to his promises
    god abhores evil, and also needs mankind; or at least the “remnant” to band together and eliminate this evil, by exposure and inviolable pressure
    if there is a conspiracy;
    if morgellons is real;
    if your fibres are like my fibres;
    then we have a duty to unborn generations,
    to fallen comerades;
    to ourselves
    and the choice of our salvation then is clear
    which path do u choose smilykins n tc?
    stand firm sarah and other sufferers….
    we can, of one accord, according to our free will, stand together and say unto our creator” please help to bring light to our suffering, that to of animals, surely they, and the children are the innocents”
    there ya go more from the raving loony witness

  255. Al – I have no idea how I got this shit. Did you write to Mary Leitao, I think I got your registration – do you call yourself Laurnie Guy also?

    I am very wary these days of certain “people” who hide behind the “God” smoke screen and “Bible Bashing”. This is not about you Al. My doc was a perfect example of this. After one consulation with him and me tellling him of my terrible pain, and numbness through my body, handing him papers and research I had done on Lyme etc etc etc. I had waited to see him for over an hour as usual. And the consultation ended with him saying “We need to Pray”!!! And I paid him for that shit.

    I am standing firm, I do not have children, but I have two young nephews, I want them to both have a successful and happy life. I will do whatever I can to protect them.

  256. i can only say that if by mentioning god and using spiriual methods of god. open to all of us who choose to call things to order, this is all i do , im a very down to earth guy so if i use god in times of evil, i deem it neccesary to break down this torrent of abusive misinformation, god is love and when u boil it down, there is only hope n love
    im not overtly religous but the right wing christian sects have given me a lot of trouble, so i study their ways and call them into judgemnet
    im orry to scare u if i have

  257. No you haven’t scared me Al, it’s ok. I kinda see where you are coming from.

  258. i must upset the yankies
    im sorry
    but lets call a spade a spade
    be well sarah im going for a while
    i wonder how they re gonna handle it?
    new age sect wankers i reckon
    do the visualization thing and tell these dudes nothing

  259. Al, you’re a fruitcake!!

  260. Have any of you ever considered that this illness is due to the oil well fires from Iraq? It was reported that the Iraqi army was dumping, or rather (pumping) chemicals into the wells before torching them. The heat from the fires could have carried the residue high into the atmosphere. But (Gulf War Syndrome) isn’t a real condition either—is it?

  261. This illness? “This” is several different, unrelated, illnesses.

  262. Why would oil well fires in Iraq cause middle aged women in Texas to start extruding fibers? And why is this somehow a more likely cause than, say, The Three Gorges Dam, or any other random environmental event.

  263. Oh, wow. I missed a lot that was written here within the last 5 days. What a display.

  264. The supersilentbug video is one of the singularly most nonsensical things I have ever witnessed. I wrote them repeatedly asking for a transcript, or some sort of explanation, and they wrote back saying “Sure you’ll send you a transcript.”

    That was six months ago…. and I have nothing. Is there a language barrier there?

  265. The film looks like the work of a schizophrenic to me.

  266. His words read like one, way before the film release, but many morgie people can’t see it, and claim to have actually sent that video to the CDC and health care providers.

  267. well ive heard of all the misery going on and there are two excellent products on the market for morgs. one is called ecovie which is an enzyme solution which can be used for a medicinal bath…………it helps heal wounds or sores . you can also use as a spritzer in the shower to exfoliate your skin with paper towels. at first you may have more blemishes surface like when a person starts getting facials. but then will start to heal over time. as for a safe way to get rid of any environmental irritants in the home including pests, but is eco friendly is a product named kleen-free naturally. these are enzyme cleaners which are harmless to animals and humans as long as not drunk or gets in eyes. interesting when cleaning home, ive shot a few lil moths with it and they croaked lol. these are enzyme based products, the second one also good for bath or even cleaning a toilet wow. these products also help with any skin discomfort or itching folks that have irritants in their home should also wash clothing they wear daily . i use detergent and/or oxyclean and lysol concentrate(the type which makes 9 gallons) about 1/8th cup full strenth in wash stuff comes out nice and clean i use no fabric softener of any kind. i would also reccomend oddly to wear polyester clothes actually more comfortable if you are having problems. make sure have clean bedding every night and spray kleen-free where you slepp get a good vacuum to lessen dust mites any irritants in the home. what you guys might not believe is if you spray cleenfree on a fiber will partially disolve hair and clothing fibers will not just breaks down organic things. I cannot use strong chemcals or pesticides in my home because i have a cat with epilepsy and he doesnt do well around those things. another bath suggesting is cheap basic ingredients which are 3-5 32 oz bottles of hydrogen peroxide and 2 cups of epsom salts. baking soda also nice in there, but optional. now after any enzyme bath do not rinse off stuff is better and more soothing to just let yourself air towel. after taking peroxide bath you must rinse off. i usually go to my shower and shampoo whole body and scalp with selsum blue shampoo. then air dry also. amke sure when brush teeth clean toothbrush with peroxide after each use and may even gargle with a half water half peroxide mix if like. this regime stops irritation itching so on may get a good nights sleep. amke sure in baths to put head under water if any irritation with eyes mouth shut. epsom salt or even kosher coarse salt can make a delightful scrub. i would reccomend for bedding some nice synthtic satin sheets very comfy make sure wash your pillow too each night. and spray bedding area with kleen-free. then be ncie and comfy i reccomend alternating a peroxide bath with and enzyme bath but never mix the two things together, this netraizes them. a bath is nice and relaxing to the mind if feeling bad too. if u have no tub, use mister bottles in shower to feel real good. you can take as many as three baths a day if irritation is severe but recommend after first ecovie bath spritz in shower with ecovie soluti0n again and rub down body gently with paper towels helps alot. i also take buffered salt tablets as long as you dont have high blood pressure (or if doc forbids). i also take a good dose of vitamin c, which is essential for your body.never take idodized salt can overdose on iodine bad idea. dont take too much will result in diahhrea and cramping(the salt tabs). You may be surprised to find you actually have great relief after a few days. note only use selsum blue after epsom salt baths not ecovie. after all isnt that is what is important feeling good? this will help any irritation (ya know could be allergic stuff for some like lady with fiberglas for some). and the salt purifies my system and the vitamin c helps you heal. which is what i think everyone wants. if you still feel depressed or need more help, you can still see a doc or counsellor. antidepressants may be helpful for some but not all some people depending on the drug can become worse depressionwise or have bad side affects for some. but if miserable try this you may not need drugs after all, and if you do, thats ok too. ann

  268. forgot to say peroxide salt mixture if to be put in full bathtub to just below drain valve below faucet lotsa water. and for joint pain ibuprofin is good but make sure eat something before taking even have prescription strengh. make sure you guys that dont feel good make yourself EAT something do not starve very bad try to nibble one something at least a few times a day. if tummy upset peppermint tea nice and calming. thanks, and been very interesting to read all posts and opinions on this forum. hagd

  269. Al has it right. Tell these fools nothing or they will “try” to use it against you later.

  270. What would, or could, be “used against” anybody, Norman? Do you mean as in “reporting” something to someone, somewhere, later? That is utter nonsense! Morgie people don’t know a feiend from a foe. The thinking all backwards. If Al were more forthcoming, although no morgie ever is, I could pinpoint his situation, and tell him exactly what he needs to do for his health. All I have had to go on, is what tiny amount of information he has shared. Do you even have any idea what you think, Norman, and why you think it?

    Not one single person has the same thing the matter with them. To put it gently, everyone is confused. Therefore, it is not even an issue to anyone who thinks they have “morgellons disease” to ask qustions of others who think that they have it. People swap ridiculously stupid home remedies back and forth. There is a complete disregard for taking anything into consideration, due to the “confused state” people are in.

    With all due respect, peroxide is fine for initial wound cleansing, but it kills white blood cells. We need white blood cells to fight infection. As long as people keep on killing them off, their immune cells can’t destroy the infection. Salt would tend to toughen up a person’s hide, after a while. See a doctor, and see a counselor is excellent advice for anyone that is overly involved with hygenic measures, and take a level-headed person along to help communicate things.

  271. Hahaha!! Not a fiend, from a foe….a FRIEND from a foe.

  272. i wasnt talking about drinking the peroxide in contast to the dilution of bath water its not that strong just bubbles a little and if folks are concerned about this they can put less inn but i really dont believe that gargling with half water half peroxide is not harmful or they would not recommend that particular use on the bottle and sell it to the public. just dont swallow like you would do with toothpaste, common sense. most of the things i mentioned are actually gentle. over time one can do this maybye oce a week or not at all. furthermore i respect your opinion as mine should be also. we can agree to disagree. i was also talking to folks with other skin condtions like the fiberglass and such. i just dont have a hard line like you do , i have found physicians quit helpful. my father is a pshychitric rn and has no problem with the idea of things my mother also was a nurse. my grandfather was a pharmasist and had his own drugstore. fortunately not all psyicians hold the view that this site does……..hmm take a bath or go on medicines i dont need . hmm..pretty easy answer. remember from history that spyphillus was considered to be purely phycological also they would let you have your sanity melt away when all it needed was a shot of penicillian. science changes on a daily basis remember that just because something is hard to classify does not mean it cant be. the fibers if one has them i consider to be more of an irritant could be enviromental, like thorns on a catus or thistle may be. or fiberglass for that matter. i do not advise people to not go to a doctor just find a good one. if you feel depressed get counselling and meds. i feel pretty good at the moment . having relief is what matters to me and others. in some cases can be apppropriate for medication. some folks can also have allergies. having compassion for people should be priority number one . what harm is there in taking a bath i feel that is quite normal. i like to be clean but i do not dig myself or scratch or scrub myself to death i just do what feels nice. and that is all that matters. i respect your opinion but feel like things such as this should be reviewed on a case by case basis. as you said the symptoms vary and that should be taken into consideration with any patient. i am just one of those people that goes to a doctor for checkups and when i need to. when taking antibiotics i only do so when very sick and doctor tells me to. and i take them all. its not so much as black and white but is more a matter of striking a balance. :)

  273. one further note peroxide can dry skin why i recommended washing off with selsum blue. selsum blue is good for sebhorrea of the scalp and dandruff and is soothing. why it has been around for so long. (;

  274. one further note peroxide can dry skin why i recommended washing off with selsum blue. selsum blue is good for sebhorrea of the scalp and dandruff and is soothing. why it has been around for so long.

  275. Ann Smith said…

    “fortunately not all psyicians hold the view that this site does”

    And what view are you referring to? These are the views of this blog.

    1. The fibers are environmental and unrelated to any illness.
    2. Morgellons is not a distinct disease.
    3. “Sufferers” have a mixed variety of physical and/or mental illnesses.

    Any doctor that diagnoses a person as having Morgellons is a QUACK.

    Ann Smith said…

    “having compassion for people should be priority number one.”

    Not if compassion propagates the lie of Morgellons.


  276. Morgies demand sympathy. That isn’t healthy. They would probably get more sympathy if they would try to get well. That effort should begin with them facing reality and quit harming others by spreading the Morgellons hysteria. There is no such thing as Morgellons, other than DOP. It is synonymous with DOP. EVERY Morgie I’ve ever encountered is delusional. Some are no longer delusional, but they are no longer Morgies either.


  277. all humans derseverve compassion not labels. morgs morgies well . thats all fine and good but how can i even be delusional when i speak not of paracites but an irritant there is a difference. like the lady with the fiberglass allergy. like how hitler put a six pointed star on jews lableing in lump group as morgs. i have never aked for sympathy from you or anyone else. dont be surprised when the other guys view this and start labeling you PSCYHES because thaat is the category you lump everyone into indiscrimately. i have read all the posts in this category and have kept an open mind? how about you? i have heard some of your own people argue the same argument, that these fibers are environmental. your site also proudly states that “sufferers have a mixed variety of physical and /OR mental illnes not always mental ty. besides regular m.d.s’s are NOT qualified to give a mental diagnosis unless also psychiatric. Leave that to the psychiatrists. (this can lead to lawsuits)just like a doctor of chiropratic cannot diagnose you with conjestive heart failure or prescribe medicines. so advising regular doctors to diagnose outside of their field is unnacceptable your own argument of this site proves this. Intelligent and adult conversation is the key to learning, not baited insults and putdowns that is what a bully does. ALL patients deserve compassion regardles of what state they are in. in a mental ward patients no longer wear straight jacckets because of this reason. and unlike many who blog in this forum, i do not parrot the same old tired aguments of either side i ask not for pity, but to hear an intelligent word spoken from those who actually pay attention to the ideology of the site. agree to disagree. a saying goes keep your friends close but your enemies closer. although i do not consider you this just not well read or educated. hagd and ty for the reply.

  278. Ann Smith,

    I think there has been some confusion. This is a debunking “morgellons disease” blog, not an advice on treatment, for people who think they have it, blog. It’s apparent that adding peroxide to bath water, not peroxide ingestion, was what I’d addressed, and, I’m sorry, because I didn’t intend to elicit ill feelings when I did so. It is a fact that hydrogen peroxide, as well as any disinfecting agent, for that matter, destroys immune cells. They really are necessary to fight infections.

    Many morgie people, if not all, exacerbate, and perpetuate, their skin problems solely because of their obsessions, and through generally not being too wise, in general, about what they’re doing to themselves. People who think they have “morgellons disease” should not over-cleanse their skin, and destroy its innate immune properties. That’s a fact, and I know of many ways they do it.

    If you’re content, and comfortable, with the habits you employ, then you have no problem. People are individuals, though, with their own unique body chemistries, their own unique problems, and, for the most part, many morgie people don’t seem to have the capacity to take that into consideration, anymore than they’re able to reason anything out. I’m sure that is not the case with you, but it is with many people.

    furthermore i respect your opinion as mine should be also. we can agree to disagree. i was also talking to folks with other skin condtions like the fiberglass and such. i just dont have a hard line like you do

    Excuse me, it wasn’t clear who you had been addressing, and I had begun my statement, up above, “with all due respect”, and I didn’t actually go into anything else.

    If you wish to learn more about what “morgellons disease” is, please read the topics’ content at the top of each page, beginning with the April archives, through to the present. The comments’ sections get pretty ridiculous, at times, but read & learn from the topic content, and click onto the hi-lighted links contained therein.

  279. Worthlessly trying to incite an argument with an actual, intelligent, extremely well read, grounded in reality, person, such as my fiancee, Tall Cotton, in an effort to make “morgellons disease” be more real, doesn’t make it so. Whatever your reality is for you, is what reality IS for you. If it is good, all is well. If it is not, there are things that should be addressed, and they are not outside-of-the-box. They are all right there, inside-of-the-box. There are a lot of morgie people who are flying high into the wild blue yonder, without a safety net, or even so much as a tether to keep them grounded.

  280. Ann Smith, you’re not Norman’s mom, are you???


  281. all humans derseverve compassion not labels. morgs morgies well . thats all fine and good but how can i even be delusional when i speak not of paracites but an irritant there is a difference. like the lady with the fiberglass allergy. like how hitler put a six pointed star on jews lableing in lump group as morgs.

    Ann Smith said…

    i have never aked for sympathy from you or anyone else. dont be surprised when the other guys view this and start labeling you PSCYHES because thaat is the category you lump everyone into indiscrimately.

    Are you a Morgie? Why do you think Morgellons is a disease? Why do you think you have Morgellons? I didn’t say that you asked for sympathy. I said that Morgies demand sympathy. Look how much you preach sympathy. Yes, I label all Morgies as psyches. I personally believe that virtually ALL Morgies have mental problems. I don’t want them to think good about me. If they did, there would have to be something seriously wrong with me.

    Ann Smith said…

    i have read all the posts in this category and have kept an open mind? how about you? i have heard some of your own people argue the same argument, that these fibers are environmental.

    My mind is open to the truth. Most of the fibers are environmental. The presence of real environmental fibers don’t prevent a Morgie from being delusional. Nor do they prevent any other mental disorder. I know lots and lots of Morgies. But I don’t know a single one that isn’t delusional, and several of them also have other, more serious mental disorders.

    Ann Smith said…

    your site also proudly states that “sufferers have a mixed variety of physical and /OR mental illnes not always mental ty.

    This is not a site. It’s a blog. And it isn’t mine. The blogmeister has his opinions, and I have my opinions.

    Ann Smith said…

    besides regular m.d.s’s are NOT qualified to give a mental diagnosis unless also psychiatric. Leave that to the psychiatrists. (this can lead to lawsuits)just like a doctor of chiropratic cannot diagnose you with conjestive heart failure or prescribe medicines. so advising regular doctors to diagnose outside of their field is unnacceptable your own argument of this site proves this.

    Regular MD’s are qualified to make psyche referrals, and plenty of Morgies have been referred to psychiatrists. No one around here has advised any doctors to do anything. My statement was that any doctor that diagnoses a person as having Morgellons Disease is a QUACK. That isn’t because it’s outside the doctor’s field. It’s because there is no Morgellons Disease.

    Ann Smith said…

    Intelligent and adult conversation is the key to learning, not baited insults and putdowns that is what a bully does.

    I didn’t come here to learn about Morgellons. I came here to teach people that there is no such thing as Morgellons. I didn’t come for the Morgies. Morgies are unteachable. I came here for those who are undecided about Morgellons. I’ve been called everything under the sun, by people that have no business here in the first place, but I’ve never been insulted. The reason for that is because I know who and what I am, and my self-respect doesn’t depend on what others think of me.

    Ann Smith said…

    ALL patients deserve compassion regardles of what state they are in. in a mental ward patients no longer wear straight jacckets because of this reason.

    All patients deserve the truth, and yes, straitjackets are still both needed and used. Where did you get the idea that they are no longer in use. Have you been committed to a psych ward?

    Ann Smith said…

    and unlike many who blog in this forum, i do not parrot the same old tired aguments of either side i ask not for pity, but to hear an intelligent word spoken from those who actually pay attention to the ideology of the site. agree to disagree.

    I feel like a parrot, but the truth doesn’t change. Morgies don’t accept the truth about Morgellons. They come here to teach us, but they don’t know what they’re talking about. All they succeed in doing is exposing their mental problems.

    Ann Smith said…

    a saying goes keep your friends close but your enemies closer. although i do not consider you this just not well read or educated. hagd and ty for the reply.

    Are you trying to say that I’m not well read or educated. You might start by putting your sentence together a little better. You forgot to tell me to kiss your ass and go to hell.

    Tall Cotton

  282. Oops, I missed this part.

    Ann Smith said…

    all humans derseverve compassion not labels. morgs morgies well . thats all fine and good but how can i even be delusional when i speak not of paracites but an irritant there is a difference. like the lady with the fiberglass allergy. like how hitler put a six pointed star on jews lableing in lump group as morgs.

    Morgies are living in denial of their mental problems. I doubt that hearing the truth will help any of them, but maybe some would be newby will be able to see what he or she is about to get into if we don’t call a spade a spade.

    If you think your skin problems are because of “Morgellons Disease”, despite the fact that there is no such thing, and you refuse to listen to reason, you’re delusional. Maybe you aren’t a true Morgie. Did you ever think of that?

    I know some things about Morgies. There’s a little bit of variation, but they’re extremely predictable. I don’t approve of Hitler. It’s pretty stupid to compare me to hitler. Think about it.


  283. Correction:

    Maybe some would be newby will be able to see what he or she is about to get into if we don’t call a spade a spade.

    Correct to read:

    …..if we do call a spade a spade.


  284. i just wanted the counter the claim of taking abath in peroxide and much water and epsom salts as much as it is diluted it does not lower white bloodcell count just covering the epidermis. to adress the person who said that this is a site that ddebunks morgellons disease well………if this forum is closed to other opinions then how will you learn as fart as debinking i think your site is what needs to be debunked. as professional and courteous as i have tried to be your constuents have been in four categories #1 negative spiteful closedminded people who only care for their own opinion and have no desire to learn more and twist fact to their own use, as you say#4 “suffers who except in a few isolated cases suffer just the same even on drugs, people dissolusined because they have sought incorrect avenues to find help.#nd people w ho have their own private agendas because of personal experience or what not. although your site does claim that some people could possibly have physical problems resulting in ther complaints mosty say ALL are delusinal on this forum . shame on you i pray you are proven wrong and that you all eat crow. if not tthere could be more cases and more frustrated people that turn the medical profession on its side over remind me of those who said that syphillus was merely a mental condition and now we know different. scientic minds that are closed to new possibilities and variables eventually fail. i have just as much a rifght to post as everyone else and respect we disagree. this is a forum for “debunking morgellons saying it is mass dillusion but WHAT if you are WRONG what will happen to this precious site? what i know about the treatment plan i posted is that it truly does help. when posting intelligent rhetoric i have mostly come oupon hostility and insult and labels. I am not depressed but trying to recover and very sane ty. but my question is what if at some pont in history will happen if you are proven wrong? what then? still insist the world is flat? your forum may focus on one tired topic but if not receptive to other opinions then is truly stagnant like diseased water.

  285. I meant white blood cells inside skin excoriations, which I know, that many people continue putting disinfectants on. I had thought that I’d stated myself clearly. Anyway…

    In the pre-”morgellons disease” era…

    * Some people obviously had pre-diagnosed conditions, that they were aware of, but, yet, seemingly knew nothing of what to expect from those conditions
    * When such people developed some skin problems, and, inevitably, thought something unusual was going on, they went to their doctors, overly concerned about it, and received DOP diagnoses
    * What happened at that point, of course, varies for people as much as whatever conditions they have that caused them to think something weirder than usual had happened to them
    * The end result, though, has been that they typically followed suit in denying that they have DOP

    With the advent of “morgellons disease”…

    * Most people seem to say that their doctors were dumb, lazy, or scared of them. Such people have an unusual belief that their doctors didn’t practice medicine correctly, truly under the assumption that they are entitled to having unnecessary tests done, to rule out everything. Some such people voice the false opinion, too, that general practitioners, are also not qualified to diagnose mental conditions. Not true, of course, but those people should go on, then, to a mental health doctor.
    They are MDs, too. The mix-ups in thinking” is impossible to understand, and I know people cannot help it.
    * It seems that a large percentage either don’t follow-up, or, that they withhold information from mental health doctors.
    * Some morgie people even instruct newcomers to seek a mental health specialist, on their own, before going to any other doctor, and to not saying anything about what they’re experiencing, in order to get a clean bill of mental health (?), “to get that out of the way”!
    * Of course, anything they obsess over, and collect from themselves, or from their environment, looks similar to anyone else’s collection of things they’ve removed. That is completely typical with DOP. All the collections look similar, and always have, because they are. It’s all that stuff that’s commonly carried into doctors’ offices, in the matchbox/ziplock bag sign.
    * The ONLY thing is, that people with DOP never had the internet before. Such people live in denial of it, anyway, of course, convinced that they’ve been inflicted with a unique and mysterious disease. That is how DOP is, and always has been.
    * So…voila!! “Morgellons disease” has been their answer. It’s just a damned made-up disease, a very sick woman posted on the web.

    People are sick, yeah, they really are!!!

    * These people are vulnerable as hell, too
    * All the so-called “professional” players in this unbelievable mess, pretend to be too dumb to know that when these patients say that their doctors told them “it’s all in your head”, that there are many doctors who have their version, too, of what occurred, and their side isn’t ever heard. Of course, to these patients, their side is all they are concerned with, and all they want to be believed. Of course, to anyone exploiting them, they’re going to keep playing dumb, too.
    * These people are getting by with it beautifully. Randy Wymore, stepping outside of his specialty, over into this pseudoscience arena, as the main player, is not only astonishing, but it seems like it would be an embarrassment to OSU.
    * Publicly announcing that these patients aren’t delusional, and that he is convinced something is going on, says so much about what is going on with him. He has even actually twisted this, himself, concerning patients’having claimed that their doctors have all told them, “it’s all in your head”, stating, in other words, that he wants us to all believe that if it were “all” inside their heads, there would not be any physical signs. All he’s doing is collecting the matchbox/ziplock crap, and trying, like a freak, to analyze it. The dumbass.

    This is keeping people from moving on to treating, and accepting, their real underlying health problems. “Morgellons disease” was designed that way, too, essentially created by a woman exhibiting madness (excuse me, but it fits), creating her case definition from so many of the varied condtions that people who have DOP have. To further her cause, they’ve all been duped, as well as others who have come along since, who aren’t even DOP patients. It’s incredible, and so obvious, that they haven’t the capacity to realize it, and so very, very, sad.

    There doesn’t appear to be any one underlying cause for DOP, although it probably has to do with fundamental aspects of brain chemistry. The syndrome is often classified into three types according to the underlying condition:

    1. Primary Psychotic Delusional Parasitosis — DOP is the sole psychological disturbance:

    * patients otherwise behave normally * reason in a rational manner

    2. Secondary Functional Delusional Parasitosis — an underlying psychiatric condition, including:

    * schizophrenia * paranoia * depression * anxiety disorders * obsessional states

    3. Secondary Organic Delusional Parasitosis — there’s an underlying physical illness present,including:

    * drug abuse * hypothyroidism * cancer * cerebrovascular disease * tuberculosis * neurologic disorders
    * vitamin B12 deficiency * diabetes mellitus

    If simple logic is impossible to apply, and the blame has to be placed somewhere, “morgellons disease” is the answer for many people.

    TC & I both had a temporary state, induced from underlying conditions, so we both recovered because we obviously had No. 3 Secondary Organic Delusional Parasitosis

    Similar account to “morgellons disease” and its popularity

    TC’s & my account, of our ordeal

    I even think, perhaps (on a certain freaky level), that Sir Thomas Browne’s centuries old “morgellons disease”, was the exact thing, then, as it is now.

  286. I don’t know where it has ever been said that anyone isn’t welcome here. Many morgie people just haven’t grasped the concept of this blog, and I regularly advise that if viewing here upsets them, that it isn’t good for them to look at anything here and they would feel more comfortable in “morgellons disease” forums.. If they could read here, and learn to apply reason to their situation, it would be grand, but too many people can’t. So, it is typical for some of those people to come here with personal attacks, after reading generalizations that have been made about this group of people who have fallen prey to this belief, and to lash out at certain individuals in as many varied ways as they can. Otherwise, things would be peaceful here.

    Many morgie people like to think (incuding Wacky Wymore, and all the other players, who should know better) , that unless you believe in “morgellons disease” people are close-minded. No, wise people look at all possibilities, and search for the answers to resolve problems. Un-wise people are lost, without a clue, and looking anywhere, and everywhere, for answers that will never be found. Clueless searching that leads absolutely nowhere, but into a darker hole of oblivion, is not akin to outside-of-the-box-thinking, that problem solvers do, at all. However, that is guaranteed to keep the myth in perpetual motion for the ones who stand to gain from it.

  287. Ann Smith,

    If you truly “just” wanted to counter the claim concerning taking a bath in peroxide, then does that mean that we should ignore the rest of your bullshit. That’s exactly what it is, bullshit. This is not a website and it’s not a forum. It’s a BLOG. It’s definitely open to other opinions, including your’s, but I’m certainly not going to respect what you say because I believe you’re lying. I don’t respect lies or liars. The lie of Morgellons is also very damaging. People can very easily die because of you, and people like you. Yes, that’s an opinion, and it’s a very strong opinion.

    You need to understand this. We KNOW what we are talking about. You are the one that needs to learn. Smileykins and I had our facts straight before we ever arrived. We didn’t come here to learn. Smileykins and I have been there. We know the truth. Don’t call yourself a round earth person. You delusional people are the flat earthers. You’re quite confused, and entirely backwards in your thinking.

    Some Morgies definitely have physical problems. We’ve never denied that. I personally believe that ALL Morgies are delusional, regardless of whether or not they are physically ill. I strongly believe that you are delusional. In my opinion, you people are mentally ill, and you aren’t going to teach anything to the medical community. Don’t you think they know what Morgies are? They diagnosed them. I don’t care what I remind you of, or how you react to what I say. I didn’t come here to help Morgies. I came here to keep vulnerable people from becomming Morgies.

    Tall Cotton

  288. snmileykins You need to be debunked otherwise peroxide woulnd not be recommended to putm on wounds unless too deep my sores have shrunk to half their size with no itching. the bath i recommended is so dilutd what you say is pure bunk. as long as not overused. and remembber syphillus was thought of the same way. i am not thinking as negative like the constituents thinking all need depression meds. i dont pick at sores just make sure they are cleaning. i hope cdc proves you wrong and even 9if it doesnt because of pharmacutical kickbacks thyen thaere will be many agry people debunking you myth. the mtyh of a closed mind. i measn if your site gives step by step directions on hoew to at first seem sympathetic towards victims and then take your view than i take it you are just as bad as the communist machine but geared to turning awy patients or giving drugs like a band aid. the goaql is trying to find a cure for the many but not the few. you may remain sceptical but continue to think the world is falt and that shphillus is purely psycological too peroxide does heal wounds and even with my compromised immune system does help hel me and many others. your retoric is the echo of partanoia.

  289. Ann, may I suggest that you get some sleep before posting again? You are deteriorating before our eyes.

  290. You said, it Weezie. Whoa.

  291. Ann Smith,

    Why do you keep talking so much about syphillis. We never said anything about syphillis, or that we ever thought it wasn’t a real disease. You may have syphillis, but that doesn’t make Morgellons a disease. You’re the one that can’t accept the fact that you are delusional. You’re the flat-earther, not us. The fact is, the earth is round. The fact is, Morgellons is not a disease. Listen to your doctor, and treat what you really have. If he ever says you have Morgellons, turn his ass in, and get another one. Wise up before you cause someone to forgo their needed medication and die because of your Morgellons non-sense. We know you want it to be a disease. That’s plumb nuts.

    Tall Cotton

  292. Tall-

    You are wrong. Karma is coming.

  293. Between the conception
    And the creation
    Between the emotion
    And the response
    Falls the Shadow

    Life is very long

  294. How’s this?

    Karma is NOW

  295. • noun (in Hinduism and Buddhism) the sum of a person’s actions in this and previous states of existence, viewed as affecting their future fate.

  296. Norman,

    If you think I’m wrong, try to prove me wrong.


  297. Which one of those religions are you, Norman? I feel that karma isn’t about retribution, vengeance, punishment or reward. Karma simply deals with what is. The effects of all deeds actively create past, present and future experiences, thus making one responsible for one’s own life, and the pain and joy it brings to others. I know Tall Cotton’s and my karma is beautiful, too.

  298. You are wrong. You will see in time.

  299. Who do you profess is wrong, about what, and what, will who see in time?

  300. Bssst! Time’s up!! NORMAN!

  301. NORMAN!!!!!!

    You most definitely don’t strike me as a Buddhist or a Hindu. Also, when I’d previously said that morgie people, who cry out that they want their lives back, needed to realize that this IS their life, you’d said I was wrong. You’d spoken in the plural sense, saying “this is not our life”, refusing to explain.

    You are wrong about that, Norman, and whether you’ll ever realize that in time, I don’t know. Any Buddhist, or Hindu, ought to know better.


  302. Ok.

  303. You are wrong. Heheheh

  304. Starlink,

    If anyone was ever right or ever wrong, you’d be the last to realize it.


  305. you are so rude Smelly,
    i cant help but wonder,
    to think of you
    is to chunder

  306. i dindt come up with the idea of straight jackets no longer being used my father is a psychiatric rn and now they use antoher method hes been doing it for about 30 years and been a former psychiatrich the ones who do restrain. so ty i DO know what im talking about.

  307. psychiatric tech

  308. Maybe they just decided to go easy on you the last time you were there.


  309. There are many different views on what is, and isn’t a disease; and what is real or imagined.

    Sometimes years or decades will pass before an adequate acceptance due to an over preponderance of evidence surfaces that does reveal the truth, and a better series of treatment protocols are created, developed, and placed into use.

    There was a time in our history that anyone with epilepsy, was simply locked away in a mental institution because they were thought to be possessed.

    It turns out damage or alterations to the hippocampus can cause cognitive disorders, epilepsy, and mental illness.

    Discovery of Novel Nerve Cell Modulator Offers Potential for Mood Disorders, Epilepsy Treatments:

    What about what actually causes of peptic ulcers?

    For many years, excess acid was believed to be the major cause of ulcer disease. Accordingly, treatment emphasis was on neutralizing and inhibiting the secretion of stomach acid.

    While acid is still considered significant in ulcer formation, the leading cause of ulcer disease is currently believed to be infection of the stomach by a bacteria called “Helicobacter pyloridus” (H. pylori).

    Ironically, when the H. pylori bacteria was first suggested as the culprit by respected professionals in medicine, did these early explorers attempting to qualify and isolate this condition receive an extreme amount of unjust, and unfair negative treatment at the hands of those in multiple areas of academia and medicine.

    Another major cause of ulcers is the chronic use of anti-inflammatory medications, commonly referred to as NSAIDs (nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs), including aspirin. Cigarette smoking is also an important cause of ulcer formation and ulcer treatment failure.

    H. pylori bacteria is very common, infecting more than a billion people worldwide. It is estimated that half of the United States population older than age 60 has been infected with H. pylori.

    Infection usually persists for many years, leading to ulcer disease in 10 % to 15% of those infected. H. pylori is found in more than 80% of patients with gastric and duodenal ulcers.

    While the mechanism of how H. pylori causes ulcers is not well understood, elimination of this bacteria by antibiotics has clearly been shown to heal ulcers and prevent ulcer recurrence.

    So too is the mechanism of how morgellens inhabits and affects the human body with a range of conditions and symptoms is being treated by mainstream medicine.

    It’s not well understood, but with any condition affecting us in a negative way, what becomes important is identifying the full range of trigger mechanisms which exist to create this condition.

    Then will a series of adequate treatment protocols be developed that are able to successfully reduce and eliminate this condition .

    While arguments will continue if this condition is mental or physical in nature, what is important to realize is that treatment protocols do exist now with some having better results than others.

    As with anything that affects us, there will be one or more trigger mechanism patterns at work. Being able to reveal what they are will be best in addressing the condition.

    For myself, I’m fascinated with the human body and how resilient and amazing it truly is.

    Real or imagined; I’ll remain open minded to the fact that there are a growing number of individuals out there who suffer at different levels.

    Accepting that a small segment of the general population goes through a horrible ordeal that most of us don’t, is a start in the right direction.

    Identifying and isolating trigger mechanisms appear to be a positive direction to go in to ultimately addressing this area for those affected.

  310. To those who don’t believe…………….
    I know exactly where I got morgellons 2yrs, 7mos. it was at a high $ hair salon, it’s real, it’s worms, black bugs[ that by the way, can fly], & yes it also has fibers….. so untill you have worms crawlling, & bugs flying out of your head body,mouth, eyes, ears,& yes your butt. you need to check all the facts……………………

  311. Hi, Nancy

    What did you have done at that posh salon on that particular day? Did many of their other clients get heavily infested with parasites, like you? Do you have a primary care physician? How are you treating this prolonged condition? Is the salon still in operation?

    Thank you, Smileykins

  312. I’ve read the entire web site from top to bottom. I’ve visited every link and have been following this for a year. I can only conclude that its a mix of both mis-diagnosis and reality, until it is clearly identified and diagnosed.

    Fibromyalgia or lupus went through the same series of speculations. The people were mentally ill and it was psychosomatic for up to a decade of misery for people until the sheer numbers of people coming up with the disease created an understanding that it is indeed, real.

    So far, no disease no proper treatment. No proper treatment, then those who may truly have this awful thing slip in the cracks.
    Time will tell.

    As far as recovery from symptoms of disease through the proper nutritional tools, that’s nothing new. Let your food be your medicine and your medicine be your food. Unfortunately, there are so many people that “own their disease” that they constantly look for the next vaccine, drug or whatever and continue to eat junk food.
    Doctors know this as well and tell their people to make a life style change as they prescribe their medications, but their patients do nothing but continue to come back with more symptoms and more meds.

    Then, there are those who use these subjects of disease as a means to make money off of unsuspecting people. Both the pharmaceutical companies and privately owned non profit companies are just as guilty of doing this. It cuts both ways… So, we have to know the criteria to discern legitimate research or non profits.
    By now, we have the technology to identify if this is fact or fiction, so it’s just a matter of time. I see the glass as half full.

    Great site and may those who truly want to be well and have optimal health choose to create that in their life.

  313. Morgellons is real. I have it. It is tricky. It is initially caused by some mite probably a scabielike entity which gets onto a person from another. This mite envelops the person. The mite can be killed off by the usual mite killers. What happens next is the kicker. The person while rid of the mite continues to suffer from stinging and itching. This current set of symptoms are caused by exposure to other sufferers or their own residual droppings or their clothing and cloth type materials which have captured these droppings; computer generated entities which are emitted by the computer and either activate already existing droppings or actually generate droppings. The uninitiated sufferer believes he/she has an illness that causes the symptoms. It is not an illness but now it has become a totally external attack. The sufferer’s environment has enough residual stinging entities to cause the sufferer to believe it is an internal ailment. This of course can rob the mind of sanity and hope. The morgellons foundation and other organizations are attempting to eliminate it as a disease but there is no visible disease only residual entities in their environment. The computer plays an enormous role in this scenario as does clothing, cloth rugs and furniture and any other weaved object which can hold the droppings. All this discussion is great because it is through it all and reading much on the subject that I have removed all but newly introduced specimens from my personal environment. I have also found a cleansing agent which does the same from the cloth mentioned above. Most importantly, my believe in Jesus Christ sustained my sanity throughout the entire ordeal (3 years). Knowing that He loved me and all mankind gave me strength to beat back this grueling life sapping ordeal. When you are ready for answers let me know.

  314. I live in the UK and have the same experience as Nancy (4th Nov above). I’ve had many of the 74 identified symptoms for morgellons – whatever that may be. What I need is a microbiologist with a fab microscope and knowledge to engage.

    The skeptical nature of this website is based on non evidence. So I challlenge the professional skeptics amongst you to substantiate your beliefs (or not) by getting your hands dirty. This would make an interesting research project for any professional passionate about researching this condition.

    Alot of the background info originates from USA. Anyone wanting to engage in this may also be interested to read one of the German research sites:
    - wow this DOP is global ;o)

    Please email me if interested in the offer above,
    Many thanks

  315. Jo, I am new here, and this site doesn’t seem to be all that active. I hope there is someone who read your post that will, as you say, get their hands dirty. I only wish I had the education and means to do so. I seriously doubt that there are very many “professional” skeptics on this blog though. I truly wonder where one would go to get the education needed to be a professional skeptic? There are only opinionated people on this, and most other blogs, that are skeptical. I have wondered where a couple of people who call everyone on here crazy got their degree also, although I have my suspicions. Let me say, to anyone reading, I am not a professional anything, except mother and grandmother. I am on the other hand not an idiot. I see alot of things being posted that if I had the time, or the desire to, I would be able to blow out of the water. I suffer, and have for going on three years now, from many terrible symptoms as many others who post here and on other blogs do. There is no need in going into all the specifics, we all know what they are. There are many of us that also know what they are not. I try to find as much info as I can about the SYMPTOMS that we are suffering, not morgellons. That is not to say that I don’t read up on morgellons also. But I find something new everyday that is just too coincidental to be delusional. I again won’t go into any of that, except to say if you have any positive information, not theories, about this, I would like to contact you. I went to the site you posted above and found some very interesting FACTS associated with whatever this is. I have actually tested POSITIVE for one virus, and know I would for another. The lady who started this blog is a science skeptic, not a professional skeptic. She said to me that she got interested in the debate and it became a hobby for her. I agree with some of the things she says, and I disagree with others. I do feel like she tries to be as fair as possible with her judgements. I also know that she might feel alot differently if she had this, delusional or not. I challenge the skeptics on this blog to prove that EVERYONE who posts here is delusional. Boy that would cost a ton of money, don’t you think? When someone calls someone else crazy or delusional without scientific evidence, they are speaking their opinion, not a fact. I wonder if people are angry because what they had was delusional and not physical, and that is why they attack others. I have been treated for DOP for quite some time, I wonder why their treatment cured them, and the same darn treatment won’t cure me? I have not on the other hand even been evaluated by an infectious disease doctor to see if what is wrong with me is in fact physical. I’m sorry guys, I have been paying attention, and taking notes for quite some time, and I am VERY positive that in my circle of professionals, there is alot of covering someone elses – - – going on. I don’t know about the states everyone else lives in, but mine has the largest percentile of malpractice in the country, which makes their liability insurance do what???? That is what is happening with me, that and my private insurance doesn’t want to pay for anymore tests. There has only been one doc to diagnose DOP, and he proudly informed my husband and I that lovely afternoon, that HE DIAGNOSES 40 to45 CASES A YEAR!!!!!!! I might add that this is a small town. I know he had no business diagnosing me with it, I just wonder how many patients of his had any kind of procedure at all done before being diagnosed themselves???? I would bet large amounts of gold that if I asked him he would tell me to speak to his lawyer!!!! I am having serious vision problems, I have stated on other posts, that I am already blind from a childhood accident. I am not looking for unprofessional help, or advice, but I pray that God sends me some help and I don’t go BLIND!!!! They don’t have a clue what they are talking about. If the CDC or NIH had produced any COLD HARD evidence that everyone that is suffering these horrible symptoms was delusional, I’d find me a large bottle of tranquelizers and just go my tail to bed. But the FACTS are that NO ONE has produced any facts yet. If there is anyway that I can help the research that you are doing Jo, please let me know!!! My email is, or Just so all of you skeptics know, just because someone acts like an authority on something doesn’t make them be. No one has proven anything publicly yet, have they?? If you think that everyone is so darn crazy, you should be contacting some government agency and telling them to get around 100,000 new rooms ready somewhere, cause if your theory is correct, then that’s where we will all need to go, cause you will never, ever, convince the ones who are not delusional that they are. Your argument is that delusional people can’t accept it. My question to you is this, if you were diagnosed with DOP without some test of some sort to rule out physical illness, would you believe it?? And should I say that you are, with that being about the strongest evidence that I have to prove it??? Unless, of course, you were on meth or some other delusional drug when you were having your delusions, and when you got off of the drug and cleaned your system out your delusions vanished. Would that make me an authority on anything? Or would it just piss you off? The real question is, if you weren’t delusional, and even your doctors agreed, except for one(and a half, personal doc is still in limbo, although he has treated me for it and I took the meds just like the pyschiatrist said to, and am worse now than then) how would you feel?? You would feel abandoned by everything you ever knew in your heart was true. In America we do not expect to be treated as we are being treated and we are truly hurt. I pray that alot of the theories on the morgellons side are WRONG!!!!! I would love to believe that our government can be trusted to do this research with every intent on finding and telling the truth, and not covering things up. I hope alot of other things aren’t true also, but if that one is true then I guess we are all headed down a one way road. If the truth is covered up and it is a real illness, the debunkers will be thrilled to know that they indeed were right. But they won’t be, if the truth is that there was a real illness and it was covered up. I only wish that as Americans, and other nationalities alike, we could all come together and put some pressure on the powers that be to quit stalling, and do their freaking research, and put an end to the whole thing. I see alot of hatefullness on these forums and blogs. I know that there are some quacks out there that are either delusional or just plain mean. But I also know that there is people out there that are SICK!! REALLY sick, and it is a shame that we are even finding out about this debate the way it is. It SHOULD NOT HAPPEN in this day of modern science and technology, not in our country!!! What the hell is wrong with all of us??!! Please just stop the criticism and let’s all pull together and make our leaders give us an answer. I have always heard that the only way to look like a bigger fool is to argue with a fool. Does that not hit home??? If you people that think everyone who has these symptoms is delusional, then why don’t you do the right thing and tell your leaders that there is an epidemic of major proportions and it is a mental one!!! If they really believe it I promise that would make them get off their butts and do something!! Crazy people do crazy things, you folks don’t seem to think that there is any real danger involved in being delusional. I don’t know if I would agree or not, but I know if we are not, there is some serious danger floating around out here. If it is real, and not delusional, then it came from somewhere and NOBODY knows where, and guess what, the way things are looking no one will, because they are NOT INVESTIGATING!!!!!!!

  316. I stated in that last post that I am blind from a childhood accident. I am only blind in one eye. I guess you all know that, by the simple fact that I am here. I try to proofread everything before I submit, I just missed that one. Sorry, and have a good one all!!!

  317. Has anyone heard of Nexia? They are a corp out of Canada who allegedly attempted to cross a cotton plant with a silk worm in attempts to make the cotton plant more resistant to the damage of the silk worm.

    Some believe, in essence, that they created a parasite that lives in cotton fabrics.

    It is anaerobic (does not require oxygen to function)
    It is also heat/cold resistant.

    I have suffered the effects of Morgellon’s for 14 years.
    I am a nurse with no history of psychological disorders.

    This is very real and anyone who thinks it isn’t should just continue to keep their head in the sand.

    For years, many claimed that lyme disease was not real.
    Then it was Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and Fibromyalgia (both of which I have a diagnosis of) that noone believed(believes) in
    and now it is Morgellon’s.

    anyone else seeing a pattern here?

    Take care and God Bless you all…….K.

  318. Silk worms do not eat cotton plants.

    Nexia have never worked on cotton, they made biosteel – a fiber like spider-silk, from goats milk.

  319. where is the cure? is anyone out there.

    we are curing ourselves with prayer and peroxide baths 35%

  320. Oh, Sandra. Stop using peroxide baths, or your skin sores will never heal. If you really are doing such a thing as that, you’re killing off your white blood cells that you need to fight infection.

  321. hey my sister is dieing from this chit im here trying to look for a cure.shes 48 and is only 93 pounds the chit is eating her alive

  322. and the thing has made it all the way to mass

  323. since my submission on dec 31 i have had a great reduction in morgs. i don’t know if my cure is worse than the disease itself but i know it is working. this is a very complex syndrome and cannot be cured conventionally at least not without an environmental scouring. if you want the treatment i am using email me at
    due to legal issues i will not publish the treatment. i am not a scientist just a victim. i am suffering no ill effect initially from this treatment but i do not know the long term effects. i cannot in good conscience keep it from those suffering like i was. i do not intend to make any money from this but i don’t want to be sued either. put morgellons in the subject line because i delete all unknown emails. may God Bless all of you sufferers and your families.

  324. Wow—so glad to find this place—my friend has been having problems for a while, and after a lengthy web search over the past few days, we think we have it nailed down to Morgellon’s.

    So now that we think we figured it out, what do we do? Who is best to treat this, an MD or a dermatologist? Would they even know what it is?

    If you can recommend a course of action, that would be great!

  325. Pat,

    I would strongly warn against self-diagnosis from internet websites. Morgellons is not a recognized condition by the vast majority of medical professionals, for the reasons delineated on this website (symptoms are widely varying, symptoms are caused by common contaminants such as lint, etc). Going to an MD or a dermatologist IS an excellent idea, though, to seek help for your friend’s condition, whatever it may be.

  326. Pat ,, do your friend a favor and do not search morgellons anymore for them ,you are doing more harm than good ,tell them to go to a dr. at once and try anything they say,support your friend through the dr. not websites,, once one person finds it just justifys everthing and any treatment a dr. will give will prolong any real help to regain control of your friends life .If you must do research for yourself and even go suggest to your friend that you will go to dr. with them for support .Good luck and let us know how it goes..

  327. It is simply amazing to me how ignorant some people can be. Sufferers of this disease are all showing the same real physical symptoms. All these people at one point were living normal productive lives and all of the sudden their whole life has been turned upside down with no hope in sight because of ignorant people and an ignorant medical community. The body is a holistic organism where every part works together to great a harmonious environment, pathogens in the body can affect everything from mental to physical, this does not mean that someone is crazy. I have just recently contracted this disease. I was staying in a hotel room with a friend where I was very sick at the time with a cold so I spent most of the evening laying in the bed. At one point I said to my friend, “I don’t know if I’m losing it, but I feel like there are things crawling on me in this bed.” we laughed it off like it was nothing, however the next day I woke up with a very itch head, thinking I was having an allergic reaction to something I just brushed it off. As symptoms became worse I went to the doctor and got cream for scabies which did not help. At one point I thought I must be losing my mind so I would try to focus on other things, it wasn’t until my cat starting having similar symptoms that I realized something was seriously wrong. I wish this on no one, but if you have not had this disease and do not know someone who does, do not judge others, you have no idea what kind of true suffering we are going through!

  328. Jenn–

    Just in the last few days, three sufferers who have commented on this blog have reported vastly different symptoms and causes, from glitter, to worms, to a “fungus.” Sufferers do not all have the same symptoms.

    In response to your comment “do not judge others,” there is a difference between making sound judgments and being judgmental. I agree, it is wrong to be judgmental, but it is very important to judge others, for example, as trustworthy or not.

    You also seem to indicate that people are telling you that your symptoms are imaginary. I would suggest that often people who say they have “Morgellons” have misperceived the cause, but not that they are imaginary. Could you please quote where someone has said your symptoms are imaginary?

  329. it wasn’t until my cat starting having similar symptoms that I realized something was seriously wrong. Your cat was having the same symptons ?????I’m sorry you have to explain this one into depth on how your cat has the morgellons symptons of fibres and such..

  330. I recently wrote to several Australian Government Agencies notifying them of the CDC Investigation into Morgellons.

    In my letter I mentioned my concerns as to the possibility of many physicians in Australia being unaware of Morgellons disease and may still assume the patient is exhibiting symptoms of a psychosomatic illness when they describe the skin and other symptoms of Morgellons disease.

    A reply from one agency stated the following:
    “I have found an article from Australian Doctor dated 15 November 2006 about this condition and the CDC investigation. I am enclosing a copy for your information. Although the article is somewhat sceptical in its tone, it seems the condition is known to the medical profession in Australia”.

  331. It really is sad our own Primister, Mr Kevin Rudd, hasn’t to date, replied to letters sent to him from Morgellons sufferers in Aussie.

    I really do like Mr Kevin Rudd. Surely if he new even half the truth he would be absolutely devasted.

    That article from Australian Doctor almost makes me feel ashamed to be an Australian Citizen.

  332. Gill-

    Try Peripheral Neuropathy (sp?)


  333. Peripheral neuropathy is a symptom, not a disease. It has many causes, including diabetes.

    It is somewhat similar to Morgellons in that it’s a symptom of several disease, whereas Morgellons is many symptoms of many disease, and not a distinct symptom or disease itself.

  334. Dear Sarah and lp, by saying my cat was having symptoms I meant that she starting itching, as I was and nothing could help her. The similar symptoms that sufferers with this disease have are blisters on the skin, fibers, black specs, depression, problems with short-term memory and a feeling that something is crawling on you. Also those suffering from this disease have found help in things like nutrasilver. I am sure Sarah that you have a great medical background for you to be making your “sound judgments” and for you to really even know what it is your are talking about or “judging”. Just for your information I do have a medical background and understand the symptoms of parasite infestation which includes not only physical changes but mental as well. Understanding science and medicine, just as bacteria and viruses can mutate so can other types of parasites. What this is, is a mutated parasite that is resistant to normal pesticides just as some bacteria have become resistant to antibiotics. Did you know that pest control companies have created a new form or pest control by keeping things like flees in larva stage so that they can multiply. well it is everything’s natural instinct to survive, therefore, if it can not survive in one way ultimately it will mutate to survive in other ways. Do you remember when AIDS came out? Doctors had no idea what it was, and if people were not dying we might be having the same discussion with AIDS victims today as you are with those suffering from Morgellons. God bless you all, may those who are suffering be cured and may those who are not, never know what it is like to have this disease.

  335. Ok, now you recogonize morgellons….many symptoms of many disease? wt?

  336. Hi Michael,

    I have peripheral neuropathy & pneumonia at the moment, so I’m feeling pretty yuk.

  337. Jenn, I am not trying to make fun of you , I do know what this is all about ,, my wife went through this ,she couldn’t show the drs. and anyone else the fibres when asked but could bring in all kinds of things in a bag to dr. We almost lost her and everything we worked for. I was alone with the kids and trying to help ,but she didn’t want it ,every test that could be done ,was done and nothing ever turned up, lyme ,parasites ,fungus ,you name it nothing ever came back to prove it. She would shower non stop and rub areas of her body to keep sores open . I am not denying that she felt something ,as she did feel something crawling ,but that is the part that is affecting your mind and it does take control and you do imagine it. She would say look here now on her arm per say and she would say see that fibre coming out of me , and I couldn’t even look at her without crying because there was nothing there, .I was talking with her dr. all the time and he didn’t know what to do also as he could not diagnose her with this ,but did take his time and send her everywhere with a kind heart , he was going to send her involuntarily to hospital at first ,but I couldn’t let that happen ,because she didn’t deserve that , we worked together and after christmas ,she was at her lowest ,frail ,not eating and just crying non stop ,phoning ambulances to take her to hospital ,and finally I said to dr. this is it ,we have to do somehting or we are going to lose her .. He agreed and when she went to dr. she even said she will try anything to help . This is when she started to get better ,he prescribed zyprexa ,within a couple of days ,the non stop showering stopped , the wounds started to heal and the bugs and fibres were going away ,slowly at first .Now after about 6 months she is back to work doing things around house again ,laughing ,playing with kids .Not everyone is the same who gets this ,my wife is a very strong person but she did have depression before and ocd .I can only go with our own experience with this ,I saw no morgellons ,I repeat I saw no morgellons and she saw fibres coming out of her ,hair that wasn’t hers, black specs, everything that is on the symptons list .If you are on this site ,you are looking for answers ,so find them with your dr. and not on those other sites that will treat you and keep you thinking that you have somethig,misery loves company if you go on those sites ,I can’t wish you good luck ,because you won’t get it there ,but go with your dr. and get tests done to eliminate everything first .Things will get better but don’t search for a desease on the internet ,and if you are a member of one of those forums ,look in the other theories section or something like that and see what they talk about ,and judge those that way ,it does make comical reading ,but some really think that way.Now good luck and get help ..

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