Morgellons is not a delusion. Many people say things like “Morgellons is just another name for Delusions of Parasitosis”, or “Morgellons sufferers are imagining their symptoms”, or “doctors dismiss Morgellons sufferers as delusional”. This is all wrong.
What is Morgellons? Morgellons is a list of symptoms of unknown causes. The main symptoms are skin lesions, itching, crawling sensations, the finding of fibers on the skin, and also other symptoms similar to Chronic Fatigue Syndrome.
Where is the delusion?
Skin lesions are not a delusion. There are thousands of reasons you can get skin lesions. People get them all the time. Obviously, they are not a delusion, as everyone can see them clearly on the skin of the people who have them.
Itching is not a delusion. It’s a symptom of a condition. There are thousands of conditions that can cause itching, including both medical conditions and environmental conditions. Itching and skin lesions can also cause each other, if you scratch an itch, it can cause a lesion, and the skin damage can cause more itching. This is called the itch-scratch-itch cycle, and it is not a delusion.
Crawling sensations are not a delusion. Like with itching, crawling sensations are a symptom of a condition, probably to do with the nerves in the skin. Crawling sensations are sometimes called “formication”, which is unfortunately sometimes defined as an “illusion or hallucination” that insects are crawling on your skin. This makes it sound like a delusion. But formication is not a delusion. It’s a sensation that feels like insects crawling under your skin. It is like when you have a high fever, but you feel cold. It’s not actually cold, but it still feels cold. Is that a delusion? No, it just feels like it is cold because the fever is creating the “illusion or hallucination” of cold. Really it’s just a sensation, and calling it a “hallucination” is a bit much. It’s not like you saw a ghost or something. Formication is not a delusion.
Finding fibers on the skin is not a delusion. If you can see a fiber (and other people can see it too), then it’s real. Fibers are everywhere. It’s not at all unusual to find fibers on your skin, I find them myself all the time. Skin also has a lot of fibers, and things that could look like fibers, naturally in it. Things like hair, blood vessels, nerve fibers, skin tissue, and sebum. These are not delusions.
I don’t think it is right to say “Morgellons is a delusion”. Lots of people have these real symptoms. They believe that their symptoms are linked to the fibers and that this means they have a distinct disease. I agree with the CDC when they say there is not sufficient evidence to say that Morgellons is a distinct disease, and I don’t think the fibers are related to the majority of the symptoms. So I think many people are making a mistake in saying they “have Morgellons”. I also think their health might suffer because of this mistake.
Morgellons is not a delusion. It’s a list of symptoms with many causes. Sometimes people have very strong beliefs about the connection between finding fibers and their other symptoms. Sometimes they describe things that sound impossible, like fibers moving by themselves and crawling out of the skin. If all the evidence shows the fibers are not connected to the symptoms, and they continue to believe unusual things about the fibers, then that might mean they are delusional about that.
But that does not mean their other symptoms are not real. Lesions, itching, crawling sensation, and even finding fibers, all these are real things. The fact that some people have some specific delusions about a part of their health does not mean that all their health problems are delusions. They have their health problems, and they maybe have some delusions. For some people, their delusions might be so strong that they interfere with treating their other symptoms. But this does not mean that all their symptoms are delusions. Morgellons is not a delusion, it’s a list of symptoms.
(addendum)
This is not just semantics. Doctors are quoting as saying that Morgellons IS Delusions Of Parasitosis, and you can treat it with Orap. Suppose a 50-year old woman goes to the doctor and says she’s itching, has a sensation of insect crawling under her skin, she’s breaking out in acne, the itching makes her scratch so much she bleeds, she has muscle and joint pain, vision problems, hair loss, swelling, fatigue, irritability, insomnia, inability to concentrate, depression, memory loss, headache, anxiety, and nervousness. She saw the ABC special on Morgellons, and examined her acne and found some fibers. So she begins to think she has Morgellons. She goes to the doctor, says “I think I have Morgellons”, and hands him a printout of the MRF case definition, and a plastic bag with some fibers and specks she found in her lesions, and urges him to look at the fibers on her skin. So, should the doctor prescribe Orap?
No. She does not have Morgellons, she has Menopause (menopause is the medical condition that most closely matches the Morgellons list of symptoms, and a very large proportion of people who think they have Morgellons are women of menopausal or perimenopausal age).
The doctor should prescribe treatment for the symptoms, possibly HRT for the menopause, they should explain that the formication and other symptoms are common effects of menopause, they can be reduced with treatment, and will eventually go away. He should explain that the fibers are probably just lint or hair and that the CDC says there is not enough evidence to say Morgellons is a distinct disease.
Then if she remains convinced that Morgellons is behind this, and this is interfering with her health, then the doctor should treat that delusion as well as the other symptoms. She may be delusional, but she’s still menopausal.
Morgellons is not a delusion. It’s a broad list of symptoms with no evidence of a common cause. It’s easy for some people to think they have it since the symptom list is so vague. Sometimes people become obsessively convinced they “have it” and that the fibers they find on their skin are connected to “it“, and they start picking them out. That’s a delusion. Sometimes the other symptoms are somatic manifestations of the delusion, and the Orap will fix them, but a lot of times the delusion has a physical basis that also needs to be addressed. Sometimes, the delusion is just a mistake.
I have challenged you to meet with me to see what I have and you have refused. You also have buried my logical posts so no one who views your site can see it. That shows me you know you are wrong.
If you can show me one person in the World that does not have this that can rub Vaseline on an ant hole type looking lesions and from out of that hole exfoliates hundreds of rolled up fibers from beneath the skin, then I will say you are correct.
But until you can show me a person that can do this that does not have this condition and as long as you refuse to meet with me so you can see it first hand you need to shut the hell up and get another hobby.
YOu have no right to talk if you refuse to meet with someone that has this and see first hand what is\t is about.
Go back to working your job at the Dept of Agriculture and trying to cover their asses by making us look as if we don’t have what we do have without beibng a witness to it first hand. (Otherwise if you are not getting paid to minimize or discredit the truth of this disease why do you spend so much time with this site? Get a job!)
Here is my number 434-974-7128 and if you are scared we can meet at a polic station or a lawyers office.
So now you have NO excuses. So bury this post like you did my others since you know you are full of shit.
I take some issue with your post, Michael.
A delusion is a false, unshakable belief.
I agree: skin lesions, itching, and crawling sensations are not a false, unshakable belief. That sentence doesn’t even make any sense. But I think in this post you may be mixing up hallucinations and delusions. A hallucination is a sensory experience in the absence of a stimulus. People with “Morgellons” say that they see fibers and insects coming out of their skin. I would say that they’re not making that up, there are fibers on their skin and things they tend to mistake for insects. Stuff is really there, being a stimulus, and so it’s not a hallucination. But what folks with “Morgellons” decide to do about the causation of these symptoms does seem like a delusion.
Morgellons is not a distinct medical entity. And still, in the face of overwhelming evidence and logic to the contrary, people still believe that they have “Morgellons.” It’s a false, unshakable belief.
“You also have buried my logical posts so no one who views your site can see it.”
I’m curious– where are they buried? Michael’s back yard?
The point of the post is that delusions are only a possible part of each individual’s medical condition. Everyone has different things wrong with them, and some of them suffer from delusions. Lumping everyone under Morgellons=DOP is not helping anyone.
I hate to get into semantics, but words are being misused, or used in an overly simple manner. “Delusion” means a fixed false belief. Belief in Morgellons being a distinct disease is akin to belief that homeopathic remedies works. Are these “delusions” in the clinical sense? There are many fixed false beliefs in modern western society.
Believing that gangs of people are stalking you is a delusion. Believing that your phone is tapped is a delusion. Believing that ants live in your skin is a delusion. Believing that the MRF case definition clearly identifies a distinct disease is a mistake.
You know that delusions of parasitosis is not just a simple delusion. It’s a complex condition, often involving physical triggers and co-morbidities. Fixed false belief is a factor, but it’s not the whole story. Morgellons is not delusions of parasitosis.
Michael,
I agree, and would say that any delusion is not simple. However, in my opinion, belief in Morgellons is different than a person’s belief in homeopathic remedies or astrology or whatnot.
I tend to be in the psyc camp that classifies something as clinical when it causes significant impairment on a person’s life. I read the behaviors that people with Morgellons engage in, and see them being significantly impairing, whether they are estranged from their family, or cannot go to work because they are afraid of being contagious, consuming Capstar, etc. I see significant impairment as common to people who allege to have Morgellons.
In contrast, I do not often see significant impairment in people’s lives when they put stock in things like homeopathy or astrology.
Morgellons seems to be a list of symptoms better explained by other medical conditions, but I think the unshakable belief makes it, for many people, delusional.
For many people, yes, there is delusion present. But it’s easy to fall into the trap of a false dichotomy. Is it “a list of symptoms better explained by other medical conditions”, or “a delusion”? It’s both, and the amount of delusion can vary from a lot to almost none.
There is a spectrum of delusion in all areas. For some people their belief in homeopathic remedies may cause them to reject chemotherapy, and die. Being “in the psyc camp” you more often see the cases of delusion that reach the clinical threshold where the delusion has a harmful effect. You also frequent fringe sites such as Lymebusters and Morgellonswatch which attract people with strongly fixed beliefs.
Of course some of those people are delusional in a harmful way. But it’s a broad spectrum, and we see one end of it. There are supposedly over 10,000 registrants at the MRF. I suspect a significant proportion of those simply saw Morgellons on TV and now believe it was a real distinct diseasebecause they saw it on TV. Are they delusional? You could call them that and be technically correct, but they are not delusional in the same way as people who believe their hair has been replaced by government nanobots.
I’m laboring the point, but I think it’s very important. There are actually two basic points I’m making.
1) Delusion is just part of the individual’s medical condition. The presence of delusion does not automatically negate all other symptoms.
2) There is a wide range of delusion, from harmless folk beliefs to paranoid fantasies. A simple equating of “Morgellons” with “delusion” is inaccurate and unhelpful.
Anyone seen this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwvLtsWUdUE
What do u think it is?
It’s a crushed up insect, squashed very flat. 200x on a QX5 (the microscope used) means the frame is 1mm across.
Most likely it’s a cat flea. It looks like one, and is about the right size. I imagine if you found one biting you, then you could think it was emerging from your skin, with it being so small.
http://images.google.com/images?q=cat+flea
Michael —
Uhmm no. These folks — at least those who post on the popular internet message boards are delusional. There is a “whack-a-mole” aspect to their mentality. Any logical argument countering their belief that their symptoms are caused by ( parasites, nanotech, chemtrails etc. etc.) is immediately met by some accusation of greed, conspiracy, evil intent etc. etc.
What’s fascinating is that their psychosis is exquisitely compartmentalized. They can sometimes apply impeccable logic to non-Morgellon’s topics, but have no ability for introspection when it comes to their skin condition. Trying to point out the obvious flaws in their logic is laughably futile.
One day, neurophysiologists will be able to define and treat these unfortunate folks.
Rowley
Michael,
The addendum is great. I am without objection!
Rowley, the internet message boards are one end of the spectrum. Sites such as Lymebusters intentionally limit participation to people who are not critical of things that are fairly obviously delusional.
I’m not saying there is no delusion in the Morgellons world. I’m just saying that a self diagnosis of Morgellons should not automatically equate to a diagnosis of DOP. A belief that you have a disease you saw on TV because you have the symptoms that Paula Zahn listed is not the same as the belief that there are insects living in your scalp.
What I’m trying to get away from is the perception that “patients were dismissed as delusional“. Diagnosing delusion is not a dismissal, and the doctors treat other symptoms as well.
It’s a problem with how Morgellons is portrayed, especially in the lay media. Often as only two choices – it’s all a real disease, or it’s all a delusion. The reality is more complex. Delusion is part of the problem, but the nature of the delusion, the underlying issues, and the path to improvement differs for everyone.
Morgellons is just a list of symptoms with no evidence of a real disease. Many people have mistakenly though it is real because of the media coverage, and some of them have thought they might have it. Some delusional people have latched onto it as an explanation for stuff they are imagining has significance. That is all. That’s what the CDC will find.
Rowley,
I think the term “monosymptomatic hypochondriosis” speaks to the compartmentalization of many delusional disorders from which many people suffer.
Hello Everybody,
I would like to think that the “Morgellons” patients that post at Lymebusters, and similar forums, lie at one end of the spectrum, but where are the people from the other end? With virtually all of the Morgellons believers, on every believer’s forum and blog, displaying a similar behavior, how do we know that the rest of the 10,000 believers are any more rational? Can anyone show me just one Morgellons believer with a sound mind?
Tall Cotton
eMedicine says:
http://www.emedicine.com/MED/topic3122.htm
Monosymptomatic hypochondriasis means to worry excessively and particularly about one specific health concern. Worry does not indicate delusion of infestation, just delusion regarding the probability of infestation. I think both delusions are often present together.
But I don’t think “Monosymptomatic hypochondriasis” speaks to the compartmentalizing that Rowley mentioned. That’s a compartmentalization in the nonoverlapping magisteria sense.
From the “morgellons disease case definition”…
http://www.morgellons.org/
*That is noteworthy, sure, but, absolutely, not insofar as proving the existence of “morgellons disease”. I think it looks almost as if the MRF is saying that it’s just fine to screw around and mess with patients who can’t reason for themselves.
There are a lot of general medical conditions that have secondary mental disorders.
http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic3447.htm
There are a lot of conditions that compromise the frontal lobe’s abilities.
http://www.emedicine.com/NEURO/topic436.htm
Naturally, medical care depends on the pathology present in an individual.
http://www.emedicine.com/NEURO/topic436.htm#section~treatment
If the “morgellons disease researchers and doctors” know number 6 and number 7 of the “case definition” — alone, even, without taking another, single, thing into account surrounding the history of the evolution of “morgellons disease” — why are they not referring patients for further tests and treatment, so they can stand a chance of recovering? They even know, through the patients’ confidential registration process, PRECISELY what their serious physical conditions are, that have led to the development of psychosis in many of them. Instead, they’re toying around with such patients, some even giving explicit online instructions concerning what to say & not say, to doctors, and how to try concealing certain behaviors. They call diagnoses of mental health conditions “labels”, too, just like the patients who hold them in high esteem, playing around just like they don’t know any better.
Michael said:
“But I don’t think “Monosymptomatic hypochondriasis” speaks to the compartmentalizing that Rowley mentioned. That’s a compartmentalization in the nonoverlapping magisteria sense.”
Ok, you have me there that the term has come to be used primarily for concerns for parasitosis. However, the term purely on its own, from what I understand (I’m currently too lazy to try to find a source) is that it’s a single-issue concern or obsession about health, which seems to fit Rowley’s point.
I can’t speak for Rowley, but his point to me seemed to be that their thought processes regarding their psychoses and delusions were separate from their thought processes regarding the rest of their lives. Thus they could reason in a rational manner about things like their work and relationships (with “impeccable logic”), but fail to see the contradictions in their delusional belief structures that would be apparent if the rational reasoning was applied evenly.
Like Wikipedia says:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delusional_disorder
I don’t think saying that Morgellons is a “Monosymptomatic hypochondriasis” is much better than saying it’s DOP. MH is used for specific fears, like forms of dysmorphophobia such as Olfactory Reference Syndrome. Koo uses MH as a term for the delusional form of Body Dysmorphic Disorder in Psychocutaneous Medicine (2003), but also says that DOP is a form of MH.
There are various things here:
Morgellon is a long list of vague symptoms, with no evidence of being a distinct disease.
Some people, such as Wymore, believe that Morgellons is a distinct disease, but do not think they personally have it. Delusion?
Some people experience the sensation of things crawling under their skin. Delusion?
Some people believe that there are things crawling under their skin. Delusion?
Some people think if they pick the things out of their skin, they will get better. Delusion?
Some people feel there are things crawling under their skin, picking makes it better, that Morgellons is a distinct disease, and that they have Morgellons. Delusion(s)?
Morgellons is not Delusions of Parasitosis because, while people will go to the doctor and say “I have Morgellons”, nobody goes to the doctor and says “I have Delusions of Parasitosis”.
Morgellons is a list of symptoms. People might think they have it for various reasons (like having some of the symptoms). People who already have DOP latch on to the word “Morgellons” as a diagnosis that gives them some power over their condition.
A person cannot know that their beliefs are delusional. If they could, they wouldn’t be delusions. So why would a patient tell a doctor that he knows that the things he believes aren’t true. One of the symptoms of DOP is denial, and in my opinion, most of the Morgies are quite delusional. These delusions often extend well beyond their beliefs about their skin. Let’s face it, most of these people are quite ill, mentally, and are refusing treatment.
TC
Michael–
You bring up an interesting point. What actually fascinates me more than people claiming to have Morgellons are those who purport to research and treat it. My favorite is “Dr.” Hildegaard Staninger. Dr. Hildy’s degrees are both from defunct diploma mills, yet she is one of the Morg community’s most revered figures. She’s either crazy or evil. I can’t decide which.
Poor Randy Wymore. I think he’s just plain hapless.
And if you look at anyone with an M.D. after their name who advocates for Morgies, you’ll find a who’s who of physicians in various stages of professional disgrace.
I would love to see a NYT Magazine feature on this cast of characters.
Rowley
Rowley,
You sound like you understand the situation with Morgellons quite well. Concerning Dr. Staninger, I think “evil” is most accurate. Morgellons patients revere and follow anyone that tells them what they want to hear. Logic plays absolutely no part in it.
Tall Cotton
Yes, an interesting bunch of people to be sure. They seem to be involved as an extension of their own non-mainstream medical beliefs, or because they supply something that they claim can help, or both.
Stricker, MD (MRF Medical Board Member) and Savely, RN, are big fans of under-diagnosed chronic Lyme in California. They seem to think Borrelia burgdorferi is responsible.
William Harvey, MD, (MRF Chairman) seems convinced there is a pandemic of Borrelia burgdorferi. He wrote an article: “ancient engine of an unrecognized borreliosis pandemic”.
All the above have treated people who think they have Morgellons with long term large doses of antibiotics.
Hildegard Staninger and Rahim Karjoo sell “Far Infrared” saunas.
Beverly Drotter, MD, sells “Divine Skin Protection” cream to treat “Morgellons”
James Matthews, MD, sells “Nutrasilver”, colloidal silver to treat “Morgellons”
Geoffrey Stuart Ames, MD, (MRF Medical Board), license suspended in 2006 for using a quack device to conduct unnecessary tests.
Robert C. Bransfield, MD, (MRF Medical Board), A Lyme specialist like Stricker.
James L. Schaller, MD (MRF Medical Board), seems to focus on selling services to patients that need a talking cure. Says he is “an aggressive academic leader”, who “does not claim to be an expert in anything”. On a recent article he had the following disclosure:
The Nutraceutical Sciences Institute sells vitamins and supplements, most of which are not approved to treat, cure or prevent any disease.
Who is Cliff Mickelson?
Indeed.
For one thing, Cliff is a Human Imagineering author, who also thinks he has “morgellons disease”. Cliff coined, “the callus”, for “morgellons disease” patients to call scabs, and he’s a regular on Jeff Rense’s radio program/website.
I think this is one of his best:
http://www.rense.com/general72/crug.htm
Here is a link to a collection of Cliff’s writings on his message board:
http://morgellonsgroup.proboards23.com/index.cgi?board=articles
Considering the big following he’s developed, I have always wondered if there is more to him than meets the eye. However, observing how things happen within this patient community, my suspicion is probably unfounded.
Cliff Mickelson? I dunno, man… maybe he was one of them snazzy Persian cats that showed up earlier… man, them things were sweet.
Cliff is a Human Imagineering author. Some of his writings are on Rumor Mill News, and he’s a regular on the Jeff Rense radio show and website. You can read what he says about “morgellons disease” in this link:
Morgellons Group — CLIFF MICKELSON’S ARTICLES: HIS EXPERIENCE & MORGELLONS OBSERVATIONS
http://morgellonsgroup.proboards23.com/index.cgi?board=articles
Here is my personal favorite:
http://www.rense.com/general72/crug.htm
Cliff is a Human Imagineering author. Some of his writings are on Rumor Mill News, and he’s a regular on the Jeff Rense radio show and website. You can read what he says about “morgellons disease” on the “Morgellons Group” message board.
Cowards…all of you. Not ONE of you will meet with a person who has this to see this first hand. That is the true meaning of delusional; to believe something you have never seen first hand and to write endlessly about it as if you have some knowledge and to try and convince others that it does not exist. That is delusional.
Meet me anywhere , any time, any place with lawyers or body guards or whatever since you are also paranoid.
434-974-7128
There is my number…the challenge exists….prove YOU are not delusional!
Randy,
If I (or any of us) were to call you, could I really expect to sit and have an open-minded discussion about this with you? Your posts are very aggressive and defensive (not to mention your endless use of name calling); why would I want to talk to someone in that state of mind?
You’ve said again and again you have nothing to prove, so why are you giving your number out? Or is that some sort of trick?
And for the record, I HAVE met someone who believed they had this. And you know, I never caught it from them, either.
Randy, do people actually say that you are delusional? If so, what do they say your delusion is?
Morgellons is not a delusion. It’s a list of symptoms.
« CDC: Unexplained Dermopathy (Morgellons)
Michael says, “Morgellons is not a delusion. It’s a list of symptoms.”
I say: “Okay, Michael, “Morgellons is not a delusion,” but when in God’s name will those who post here refrain from insulting those who must deal with painfully real, horrendous symptoms every day of their life? When will they stop calling those who are very sick delusional, nuts, or crazy? There’s no need to even use such words. I’ve said a number of times that I haven’t a clue in the world what condition I’m suffering from, and at this point, no one else does either. The one thing I do know is, my “list of symptoms” are not delusional. They are, however,identical to the symptoms others suffer from, the symptoms called Morgellons. I remain as sane, alert, and aware as I have always been. Why do certain individuals here act as if it’s their God-given right to insult and condemn those who call their affliction Morgellons? It’s as if the word alone is an affront to their intelligence, which in turn prompts them to challenge these sick people. It is a sad, sad state of affairs when simple, informative conversation and the exchange of new ideas no longer flourish.
June I think there are two things.
Firstly some people are just rude and swift to judgment. So they act dismissively, and even derisively, regarding people who believe in Morgellons.
Secondly, you get a little caught in the crossfire. There are some people who clearly are having delusions about some aspect of their “Morgellons”. I don’t know if you are delusional or not, but some people clearly have some delusions as a part of their sickness, and perhaps you feel insulted by association?
The list of symptoms is very long. It almost exactly matches other lists of symptoms, such as Menopause. When you say “they are identical”, you probably just mean that you have itching, lesions and fibers. Well that also covers about 90% of skin conditions.
I’m really sorry you are sick. I don’t know what is wrong with you. But I do know that no evidence has ever been presented that even hints that these people have any common disease. The list is just too long and vague.
If you think you have a distinct disease, then why can’t you make a short list of symptoms that cannot be duplicated by other disease?
(Admin note, the spam filter is being unusually aggressive. Let me know if you have trouble posting. Some post above my be duplicates)
Open honest discussion , YES. Tell me where and when you want to meet. I will show you what this disease is all about and afterwards you will apologize to all of us that reallyu do have this disease.
Just keep in mind I have had this for 20 years and you have NEVER seen a real case. That is fact. The rest is fiction.
Let me know when and where.
Randy
And if any of you know it alls had such a horrible disease and had a site so full of BS run by X drug addicts you would be defensive too. Walk ih our shoes why don’t ya. Be scared for life with unhealing skin lesions that have fibers coming out of them by the hundreds daily and see how you would react to a bunch of people who have not got a clue but act as if they are all knowing. It would piss you off too.
When and wehre. Put your reality where your mouth is.
434-974-7128
cisfl2004@netzero.com
PS THE ONLY WAY ANYONE CAN TELL IF THEY HAVE THIS DISEASE IS IF THEY HAVE THE FIBERS. PERIOD!! THAT AND THAT ALONE DEFINES THIS DISEASE. IT CAUSES THE NON-HEALING SKIN LESIONS, THE ITCHING and BITING FEEELING. IT CAUSES FATIGUE SINCE THEY CLOG UP YOUR LYMPH SYSTEM AND THEY MAY OR MAY NOT GET IN YOUR BRAIN LIKE A STICKY PROTEIN WOULD. BUT FIBERS ARE THE ONY THING THAT DEFINES THIS DISEASE. IF YOU CAN NOT HAVE THEM COME OUT IN THE HUNDREDS WHEN YOU APPLY VASELINE, YOU DON’T HAVE THIS. PERIOD!
Randy, do you brush your teeth with equimax horse de-worming paste, also, like someone said that Dr. Schwartz recommends?
It may be true that Morgellons is not a Delusions of Parasitosis, but most of the people who claim to have Morgellons are clearly delusional. Morgellons is a set of symptoms, but the patients display the symptoms of Delusions of Parasitosis. I may seem to some to be quick to judge, but this sound opinion was not formed overnight. Their doctors agree. It’s time to cut ths bullshit and get honest.
Tall Cotton
Tallcotton says, ” Morgellons is a set of symptoms, but the patients display the symptoms of Delusions of Parasitosis.”
—————————————————
I say, “It’s you who needs to cut the bullshit and be honest,TC. You’re a parrot. You see a couple of sentences written by someone else, and lo and behold they show up in your posts. One has to ask, have you ever had an original thought of your own?”
——————————————————
Michael says, “I do know that no evidence has ever been presented that even hints that these people have any common disease. The list is just too long and vague. If you think you have a distinct disease, then why can’t you make a short list of symptoms that cannot be duplicated by other disease?
—————————————————–
I say,”The list is too long? Too long for who? Vague? Some say the graphics are more than they can bear, that the reality of Morgellons pics. stayed in their heads for days on end.
I was a nurse for appx. 25 yrs. I trained in London, got my degree, and when I came to the U.S. my degree and credentials came with me. I’ve never worked in an American hospital. I chose instead to work in private practice, alongside the doctor. Cardiology, Internal Medicine, and Family Practice.One of my duties in all three practices was to get their medical history from birth on, and you know what? Pick any disease you want, question 20 patients a day who have angina, or twenty with arterial fibrillation, or 20 with congestive heart failure,and this is what you get. Most will share at the most five or six dictinct symptoms. Their other symptoms, which can be many, bear no resemblance whatsoever to any of the other patients. Why is that? 1)It’s because each patient is unique,and 2) Disease doesn’t play favorites. There’s no way in God’s world that you can line up 20 diabetics, and give them all the same daily dose of insulin. Same with Crohn’s disease, Alzheimer’s, any disease. And if anyone thinks this will not be so with Morgellons, you’re dreaming. That’s why they have lab tests. They narrow the field when it comes to pinpointing a specific disease, and sometimes, they can even disprove a diagnosis. So believe me when I say, there’s no such thing as a list that’s too long, or too short. One page or ten. Simply put, we’re all different.
June says:
How’s this?
In March 2006, you were in isolation for three weeks in an intensive care unit with “a virulent strain of MRSA infection”. You said that it spread into your blood stream and lungs. You stated having a theory that the MRSA entered a “morgellons lesion” on your knee and that you most likely infected yourself by touching your face or nose after touching the knee. You told people, “You catch it like a cold or the flu. By droplets entering the nose and exploring the Morg lesions up there”.
Cutting the bullshit, Part Two:
You said you had a large blood clot in your left thigh, followed by an enormous saddle thrombosis in each lung. You are lucky to have survived that, and your Factor V Leiden Mutation was discovered, which, as you articulated, “puts me smack dab in the ‘High Risk’ category for thrombosis of the brain, lungs, and heart”.
Why evade answering Michael’ request, like all the other things you come here blowing up over and then can’t deliver? Other than the serious conditions you know you have, or have had, many of your other comments on LB pertain to discussing symptoms of the bullshit that you can’t cut through, and they’re DOP related. Don’t you treat with something for depression, like zoloft? Open up to your doctor. That medicine may need to be changed or the dosage increased. You know coumadin’s side effects, too, June.
http://www.healthcentral.com/druglibrary/408/coumadin-side_effects_drug_interactions.html
June says:”When will they stop calling those who are very sick delusional, nuts, or crazy? There’s no need to even use such words.”
I’ve looked through the discussion on a few of this blog’s posts, and have yet to see a Morgellons skeptic call a person with Morgellons crazy or nuts. The only times I see those words being used are by people who allege to have Morgellons saying they have been called these things.
As for delusional, I don’t understand how this is a slight. I understand there is a stigma against mental health conditions and people are very adverse to the idea of having them, but when one says “it sounds like delusions” it’s not meant as an affront any more than someone saying “it sounds like depression” or “sounds like high blood pressure,” in my opinion.
Moreover, when it comes to name-calling and using words that do not need to be used, well, I see the scale tipping not in the favor of those who say they have Morgellons.
http://thefiberdisease.proboards78.com/index.cgi?board=general
smillleyskins, Talllcotton, and Michaellllon
Things like this are examples of how to make patients believe what they need to believe. I’ll try saying this by total avoidance of the core issue, by beating around the bush and saying that it’s my belief that it’s the essence of “morgellons disease”.
MY post was deleted. I said Meet with a real person.You guys chickened out. Where and when? Why no takers. Cuz y9ou guys are working for the dept of agriculture trying to cover your tushes. So now delete this post since you guys have been found out.
Meet with me a real person that has this and THEN have an opinion with some freaking knowledge behind it. BUT NO! You delete my posts. CHIDKENS and BSERS. How sad to be found out.
Your post is still there Randy. Scroll up. It’s the first comment. Or click here.
http://morgellonswatch.com/2007/06/26/morgellons-is-not-a-delusion/#comment-31484
Nobody will meet with you because tens of doctors have already examined you and they found no evidence of “Morgellons”. Nobody here is a doctor, so examining you will prove nothing. If the doctors can’t see it, then why would I be able to see it?
Randy,
You know that you were diagnosed with sarcoidosis. Have you been evaluated for neurosarcoidosis? Honestly, I mean, if getting better is what you want to do. When I’d brought up the fact that sarcoidosis can attack any organ, including skin, you’d said that you were told that your cutaneous signs/symptoms were not due to it. Have you considered, or is it possible, that, had you left your skin alone, it would have been easier for the doctor to have seen cutaneous sarcoidosis, rather than to have seen, only, wounds from it? What are your skin symptoms? Something like the mentioning of anthill-like mounds of fibers has been all that I’ve seen you say about it.
If you deny sarcoidosis, have you looked into familial diseases of persons of jewish descent? It seems that so many of the patients who think they have “morgellons disease” believe that we pick on them and make fun, but nothing could be farther from the truth. I recall that you’d had your appendix removed not that long ago. Can you, or have you, honestly, ever looked into this condition?
http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic1410.htm
Thanks, Smileykins
_________________________________________________________________________
The rest of what I’m saying is not to Randy. I stumbled upon some very interesting material today, and would like to share.
From the November 22, 2005 issue of Pharmaceutical Executive
“Patients Are Playing Doctor on the Web. It is a Whole New Game for Pharma.”
http://pharmexec.com/pharmexec/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=211213
I haven’t explored this patient message board, yet, but I look forward to it.
http://www.crazymeds.org/
This particular link might help someone, or someone who knows someone, who is not of a fixed belief in “morgellons disease”.
http://www.homestead.com/healthanxiety/home.html
My sarc is not nuero..it was diagnosed from a lymph node biopsy finding non caseating granulomas. I have no pulmonary involvement and my vitamin d levels are so LOW that I am now on Prescription Vit D from a doc who knows the symptoms I have and stated that they are unusual and has the guts to look into the hand held microscopr and admit he has not got a clue to what I have but it sure is “something I have never seen before.” So again WRONG! All you guys are are chicken bsers or peope working full time to try and make like this thing does not exist otherwise you are some sick bored people minding business that you have no right having any interest in since you are not helping and have no knowledge of. Cabish! Get a life.
Also I come from a medical family, so please do not diagnose me please.
I know what I have and that it is not anything I or any doc I know, friend or family has ever seen before. I know that the equimax is doing wonders.
BTW: They took a biopsy of an active lesion and found no sarc.
I don’t pick, I now rub in a circular motion to remove the hundreds of black fibers and specs that come out. When it heals instead of removing the pigment like the picking would do it now just leaves a very dark mark that in time, I hope will disappear by normal skin processes. I have found that picking causes the fibers to dig deeper into the skin, burrow deeper, I should state, and that rubbing in a circular motion causes them to come out, especially if using vaseline or equimax.
My belief is that it is a parasite developed by the dept of agriculture to help somehow with earth changes and making our crops stronger and resistant to large swings in weather conditions. This “thing” got into humans and made itself part of us and is causing all these problems and they know what they did but admitting it would cause so many legal battles that they MUST make it look as though the ones suffering are crazy and “blame the victim” is the course of the day.
I feel that this site is one run by that department because I do not believe that humans can be so insensative to a plight of very sick and hurting mothers, children, women and men unless they are getting paid to as part of their job. Otherwise they are just plain evil and bored sick individuals.
We may never find out who did this to us and we may never be cured of it but we are still human and we still have something real. If you are doing your jobs, then you must look at yourself in the mirror and ask if it is worth selling your soul for a paycheck. If you are not and you are just doing this that you have no soul to sell.
Seeing this in person will make you ask G_D for forgiveness for what you people have done to many of those suffering but you all are cowards hiding behind the Wizard of Oz curtain pretending to be all knowing. Pull away the curtain and meet with a real person so you can see first hand.Then go to church and ask for forgiveness.
Continuing to go on BS-ing about something you know nothing about makes you look really stupid. And when I wrote that comment that the post was deleted , it was, I had a buddy of mine look at it with me and it was gone. Thank you for placing it back.
Randy
The last two paragraphs go out to those not involved in a coverup for a paycheck.
Yes, it’s true, I didn’t read all of the above (yawn).
It’s just that I’ve been thinking Michael. If you do live in So Cal, then I was in your hood this week doing the Universal/Disney tour. Those masters of illusion reminded me that so much of what we think we see is illusion–this is true. As a matter of fact, we can’t really trust anything we think we know because we rely on a couple of inadequate senses that don’t cover the spectrum of whatever reality is–ever hear of Plato’s Allegory of the Cave? If our senses deceive us into believing that we have a fiber-producing disease, then our senses also deceive us when we think we hear, for example, a foghorn and not a trainhorn that may actually have been an alien spacecraft horn (no, I’m not a ufologist). There is no “objective reality,” just different opinions passed-on as fact once enough people agree to agree. There is no proof that we are any more or less mistaken about seeing fibers than we are about seeing a star in the sky. The star looks small, but we believe it is big. The fibers look like fibers emerging from skin, but may actually be something else. I don’t KNOW that there are fibers coming out of my skin because I have seen them and others have seen them, but I know that if it is an illusion, there is something causing the illusion (not carpet fuzz, dust, etc). And no, I don’t believe my brain can cause illusions in the brains of other people, so the delusion theory doesn’t fly with me. I guess I’m comfortable knowing that there is much we don’t know yet but may someday uncover, whereas you (and many like you) seem to cling to a scientific ideology of knowing the world. Your desire for assured knowledge of the world is somewhat like a religious zealot dogmatically espousing his/her faith; ironically it’s a metaphor you’ve used to describe the Morgies. So, look who’s talking!!! I simply don’t think that the suspension of belief that a disease like Morgellons can happen is so great. Strange diseases happen, or all strange diseases be illusions.
Honestly, I don’t mean to attack you, and that is not what is meant. I simply think that you and many like you operate from an emotional position more than you realize. Personally, I steer clear from most zealots, religious or scientific. I, like Socrates, know that I simply do not know, and I am woman enough to admit it.
Hope all’s well,
Aherah
Oy vey
“My belief is that it is a parasite developed by the dept of agriculture to help somehow with earth changes and making our crops stronger and resistant to large swings in weather conditions. This “thing” got into humans and made itself part of us and is causing all these problems and they know what they did but admitting it would cause so many legal battles that they MUST make it look as though the ones suffering are crazy and “blame the victim” is the course of the day.”
Where is your evidence of this?
You expect people to beleive you have a fiber disease when you spout stuff like this.
Did you know HIV was made by the government to get rid of blacks and gays?
911
As a Jew and very proud of it, we often say SHOW ME. I am wiling to show you. You are afraid to see that you are wrong. NOthing more to be said to those paid to cover this up.
You are all brainless and cowards. I made a very good offer and you refuse. That is so clear to see. You are all phonies and I, with this am real. PERIOD!
Good bye losers.
Also people notice if you go to this site the virus’ and spam you will soon get.
You’re real…. full of it, Randy!
And everyone knows it!!
Delusions are not what one senses, but are fixed and foolish beliefs about what one senses. Like other beliefs, they are sometimes passed from one individual to another. This has obviously occurred in many cases with the Morgellons Delusion. This isn’t known to everyone, but it is known to those who have educated themselves on the subject. Everyone who believes they have this phoney disease should stop and ask themselves, “Why do I need Morgellons?”
Tall Cotton
Randy,
People who believe they have Morgellons, actually have a variety of illnesses. Some of those could very well be contagious. It would be very foolish to deliberately meet with a sick person, despite the fact that Morgellons does not exist. Besides, meeting with you wouldn’t prove anything, except possibly that you have the symptoms that you claim to have. That doesn’t prove the existance of Morgellons. There’s too many other diseases that have the same symptoms. You’ve been diagnosed, and your diagnoses do account for your symptoms, and I’m not referring to Morgellons. I understand how you could think that we are afraid. It’s because, like all Morgies, “you” live in fear. But your opinions about us are totally wrong, but you can continue to believe it if it makes you feel better about yourself. I can see where you would need it.
Tall Cotton
One last thing..just because YOU fall into the above category does NOT mean that others do. You are short sited. If I am correct you were a drug user and THOUGHT you had this by self diagnoses. That is not my case. This is real. NOw good bye people it is not worth bringing knowledge to swine. It is like placing make-up on a pig..it makes the pig angry…obviously and it just doesn’t do any good…not really.
Do you folks ever recognize how mean you are? What’s your degree of road rage? Why is it so difficult to accept Tall Fuzz that while you evidently suffered from some sort of mental meltdown, as Smiles admits was documented by your physicians as what? PTSD/schizo, Randy might actually have something novel going on? You throw around opinions on other’s states of mind because you need to repent from years of your own bizarre behavior. THEY ARE NOT YOU! Deal with your issues and leave the rest to deal with their own. And Randy’s right, unless you’re a physiatrist who has studied Randy’s situation for an extended period of time, you’re in no position to call him crazy. You’re like a child saying “you’re stupid” or “you’re crazy.” Grow up already!!!!! And while you’re at it, GET A LIFE!!! You’ve been blogging here almost daily for at least a year and a half. How has this behavior improved your life? If you really feel the need to punish yourself for being a Morgellons freak for so many years, try flogging yourself.
Twist and shout.
THANK YOU
TO SMILEYKINS,
You are the biggest loser. Get a life! You probably don’t have job and are ugly and pathetic. Find something useful and make VALUE of your pathetic LIFE. This disease is REAL! My sister has it and her husband also and he happens to be a very well respected physician, so there YOU IDIOT!!!!!!!! Oh and by the way, they are both graduates of STANFORD university so they are trying to research this and it is real. They contracted it through a sandflea. I believe fleas, ticks, lice, bedbugs, and alot of infected insects vector this disease. In addition, it is contagious, so my sister will not let us come into her house. It can be caught through skin to skin contact if you are exposed to an infected person for a long length of time or even a short time if your immune system is down and cannot fight off this unknown parasite or whatever it is!!!! To SMILEYKINS, get your ass out of your head and be productive, you are the biggest idiot for all your stupid comments. I would not wish this disease on my worst enemy, but i HOPE you get it or get some other kind of ugly disease since you are the UGLIEST person EVER. Get off this blog and GET A LIFE!!!!! You are the WEIRDO and the DELUSIONAL ONE!!!!!!!!!! You are not even worth my Time, bc you’re a LOSER!!!!!!
TO TALL COTTON, You are a pathetic piece of crap!!!!! You are very UGLY inside and out, i can just tell…lol. You are going to get PUNISHED by the GOOD LORD above. This disease is real as RANDY has stated!!! I have seen it first hand and what it has done to my sister and her family. They are very well-educated and her husband is a NEUROLOGIST. You are the UNEDUCATED LOSER and probably a SCUMBAG!!!!!!!!! Leave the sick alone!!! I hope you get a DISEASE so we can make fun of you and deny you and say you are delusional. You are the biggest, fattest bastard who NEEDS to get an education,okay!!!!!!! Take it from me, a UC BERKELY grad!!!!!!!!! You are an idiot and know nothing about Morgellons, it is sooooooooooo real and you are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO wrong. GET A LIFE AND GET A CLUE!!!!!!! YOU UGLY PIECE OF FAT CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! btw, your’e not such a TALL COTTON, you are a piece of SHORT CRAP!!!!!!!!!! HA HA to you when this all comes to surface and you are PROVED WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hi Randy,
I also believe the dept of agriculture is resp. i’ve called the cdc everyday trying to get answers for my sister. they seem suspicious as if they are holding something back. they were supposed to get a task force together and come out to LA to investigate and begin the studies. i read your story about equimax. i think i’ll have my sis try it. have you GARLIC TABLEts. she takes 12,000 mg spread out through the day (4000 mg 3 times daily). this has improved your condition soooooo much and healed all her lesions, or most of them. ANother thing that has helped is CLEANSING/ detoxing your body and taking cellfood (oxynated your body). parasites cannot live in an oxynated environment. PROBIOTICS really do wonders to. The friendly bacteria will kill the bad bacteria. She has also tried CIPRO and DIFLUCAN, but she would rather not. A holistic route is better and more safe for the long run. THE PROBIOTIC she takes is Jerusalem Artichoke powder morning and night and eat lot of yogurt with live cultures in it. Hope that helps. Also, a zapper helps kill the parasites. Drink APPLE CIDER VINEGAR restore the PH of the body so parasites cannot thrive in that environment. THEY LOVE acidic environments, vinegar makes your body less acidic. hope that helps and i pray everyday for all the sufferers of this disease as it is painful both emotional and physically. my sis is sooooooo tired of the daily cleaning and fatigue she suffers from. she also has joint pain in her legs similar to switching pain. the brain fog gets worse to….. it seems to be worse in the morning (systemic) and at night the parasites seem to come to the surface and be more active on the skin and bite, crawl, itch, sting and cause so much frustration. do you have any tips i can pass onto her?
TO Michael,
To educate you a little. The list of symptoms really vary from individual to individual. There are basic symptoms like itching, crawling, biting, stinging, and the fibers, black specks, and white granulars (look like salt specks) that come out of the skin. Some people get lesions and others don’t. For example, my sister has the joint paint, shooting pain, brain fog, fatigue, and her teeth hurt. she also has some hormonal imbalances due to this disease. Her husband on the other hand, has different symptoms yet some are alike, biting, crawling, etc and the intense itching and surges like ants or parasites are living all over your body and this is usually felt mostly at night time when the sun goes down for some reason and he gets muscle twitching, cold sweats, severe brain fog, fatigue, and back pain, and hair loss. As you can see the common symptoms are: FATIGUE, Neurologic problems ie brain fog, joint pain. Those are the most common systemic problems these parasitic organisms cause, however the common factor is the HIGHLY UNUSUAL feeling that bugs are living on you and sometimes you get this electrical or fuzzy linty feeling all over your body, but they say it mostly affect their legs and arms, however anyone that is near them begins to itch their nose or scratch their hair or something…they pop on other (trust me on this one)….it is so unusual in nature that the people who have it KNOW they have it and can describe it to the tee. It;s hard to believe but it is REAL. It is an epidemic hitting the US and other countries!!!!!!! My sister and bro-in-law are NOT delusional, they are well respected, career oriented people who are highly educated, never took drugs, or smoked, drank NO ALchol, No sodas, nothing. They were pretty healthy individuals who lived a normal middle-upper life. GOOD HONEST PEOPLE who were unlucky in contracted this mysterious and strange disease. THat is why the stymptoms vary, like any disease affects people in diff ways but there are common sytmptoms like the bitting, parasite all over your body feeling, fatigue, brain fog, etc…. hope that helps…. sorry to say this but i hope more people can contract this so they can fully understand that it exists and something needs to be done quickly b/f these things eat up at my sister’s nutrition and begins to debilitate her!!!!!!!
Jane,
You can call me if you wish.
There is a report going around that was published in the NY Times about a new type of parasite June 24th NY Times, that has just been discovered in humans that have never traveled out of the country. It is a very interesting article and they have found this to be something not already known yet similar to a tape type worm.
This disease is so real. I am managing with it, exercising for 45 minutes a day(tredmill) eating a non-sugar 1200 calorie a day diet, using Equimax on the lesions and Bowltrol..I think it is called..I am not at home right now to check the label, which is used to rid the body of parasites via the intestinal tract.
I just wish that when I place vaseline on my arms hundreds of black spots did not surface, that scares the bejeebers out of me knowing that something so strange is inside of me but you learn to live with it.
Please feel free to call me or have those close to you that need to talk call me. With more and more smart people getting involved, we will eventually find out what this is, how to get rid of it and then, if the need be, who is responsible, but that is at the bottom of the list. Getting healthy is primary.
434-974-7128 I screen so talk after the very short message.
With respect,
Randy Beth
Jane, it’s even been reported that I wear cheap Walmart imitation cologne.
http://of-morgellons.blogspot.com/
Read, and feel free to leave comments there, further purging yourself.
Randy, is this what you’re referring to, from the NY Times?
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?sec=health&res=9E03E7D71239F93BA15755C0A960958260
If not, I apologize. If so, it is from 1996, and I’ve cited the below article, pertaining to it, more than once, on this blog. Please read both, and see the relevance to the situation:
http://healthresources.caremark.com/topic/parasitosis
Please Look up Bt, a monsanto science project gone awry. It is was Bioengineered I blame Monsanto for this GLOBAL epidemic. It is in the soil and in pesticides.
Trisha
Sadly, pesticides, and other poisons, are also regularly misused by some patients who think that they have “morgellons disease”, seemingly, while expecting to be looked upon as being environmentally conscious. Monsanto has nothing to do with that, and can’t be sued for it, either.
Speaking for myself, I first care about finding how to get it out of our bodies running a clcse second with finding out what it is then we can venture to who did it. But right now, we have to find out how to get it out of our bodies and stop the spreading of it.
Today I spend five hours applying vaseline to a teeny tiny itsy bitsy spot on my arm that has not yet healed and out came hundreds of black specs, hundreds. When viewed in a 100X microscope we have balls of fibers that came out of my arm from under the skin. Freaky freaky freaky.
I am willing and able to give and audience and show anyone who wants to see this freak of nature happen, front row seat. You will never doubt that this is real after you see this.
And those who are sick with this have to learn to LIVE with this freak show every day and then they have to put up with reading BS from those afraid to actually see this phenomenom when offered. What a joke.
I think we are all very strong that are surviving in the face of such sites that claim knowledge when in fact they have none and will not allow themselves to see the truth.
And yes pesticides are used, gasoline is used, rubbing alcohol, creams, lotions, oxygen chambers, prayers, diets, more prayers, bargaining with G-d, meds, more meds and more prayer and anything you can find to help yourself and search for an answer when you have such things happening to you. So your point is? We are suppose to be green conscious..are you high?
Also Monsanto and possibly Eastman Kodak and the Dept of Agricultrue do have something to do with this ( my belief ) but that is not here nor there right now. We need to find out what it is, then how to rid our bodies of it without killing ourselves in the process and then find out how we got it.
http://Cherokeechas.com
has a very good little speech from Wymore on his site. It is worth going to see if you have not been to their site lately. It talks about know it alls that know nothing.
Trish..got a link?
What is my point, Randy? My point is, that there is no such thing as “morgellons disease”. Many of the delusional parasitosis patients, who believe in “morgellons disease”, cause themselves irreparable damage, which can hasten their death.
Someone like that, whose mind is already in a very confused state (and nobody with it appears accepting of the fact), misinterprets what they’re experiencing. What I was referring to, was how such patients talk out both sides of their mouths, acting as though they’re really concerned about the state of the environment, all the while they’re poisoning themselves.
I understand that you’re all scared, angry, and feel sure that you’re infested with something that you, perpetually, keep having to kill, and that you all want someone to pay for what you think they have done to you. Those are very strong, shared and fixed, false beliefs that you’re embracing and defending.
By employing such devastating practices as applying horse de-worming paste to your skin (open sores, no less), you, like so many others, are so much more seriously ill, as time goes on, that you geniunely don’t know what you’re doing.
One doesn’t have to be a rocket scientist to see how this whole thing of “morgellons disease” started, and how seriously ill patients are being used. For the sake of all of you who wouldn’t, couldn’t, won’t, or can’t, follow up on your actual health conditions, and got tricked into falling into this bottomless pit, I wish that it hadn’t happened. It has happened, though, and you’ve called the attention to it, yourselves, willingly, and, yet, I don’t think that most of you understand that.
I have nothing to say to you . There is a disease out there that has not yet been discovered and is new therfore it has no name but it exists. Period. Are we on that same page? There will always be hypocondriacs out there but that is not here nor there where this disease is concerned. To say that some don;t have it does not equate that none have it.
And furthermore the Equimax does work. This is a parasite. Period. You know nothing of what is real therfore until you actually see a real case your words fall upon deaf ears.
Randy said:
Of course we’re not on the same page, because, I’ve witnessed, on three separate occasions, how quickly the CDC has sprung into action when a doctor has contacted them over just one patient with something unique.
Yes, “morgellons disease” is, indeed, “real”, as far as being a very sad phenomenon that’s been brought to everyone’s attention. The unfolding history is very open, and easy to understand, escaping patients who think that they have it because their abilities to reason are compromised and their minds are incorrectly focused on all the wrong things.
And exactly how and when did you witness on three separate occasions, the CDC spring into action? You are so full of shit. Please, tell us all about it.
I was wrong, Fred. Four times, I’ve known the CDC to rise to the occasion when contacted by doctors. I’d forgotten about the time that a girl I went to school with became very ill, from what her doctors thought was sleeping sickness, and the CDC was contacted. It was meningitis. Then, thirty years ago, during one of my daughter’s hospital stays, a baby down the hall was quarantined with what was determined to be meningitis, again, that they said she had probably gotten from a fly bite, while on a camping trip with her family. Another time, a neighbor was stricken with an unusual illness and they sent a team to the hospital. It was later determined to be a brown recluse bite, and after a long battle, he expired. Also, my stepfather was hospitalized with a bad infection, and necrosis, of his foot, once, and the doctors were baffled over it, contacted the CDC, and they advised an experimental drug that was shipped here, overnight.
I’m not full of shit, asshole.
Meningitis is unique???????…you are full of shit! This is something unknown and I am willing to prove it and show anyone who wants to see. The CDC is not going to spring into action especially if they may know who caused it. Have you not seen The Insider and that was just about tobacco..get real when you are taking about thousands of people and it may be the fault of a government agency like the Agriculture Dept..yeh..CDC is gonna spring my ass.
I will meet with any of you with my doctor that has been treating myself and my wife for over a year. I have photos, vidoes, samples, and an MD that agrees as does the cdc that this could be something, my doctor is currently treating 26 patients with this disease. Several over the last few years have died from this.
I had knee surgery where they in fact found the fibers in the connective tissue in my knee.
If you can prove me wrong that I am delusional and this is not real, I will offer you $10,000 cash with a contract signed in front of a lawyer, on the other hand I would want the same offer from your self if possible, either way the 10K to you I will offer no matter what. So what do you think.
There are now thousands upon thousands of persons that suffer from this and you are very destructive to the medical field and to science. You are a disgrace to human kind. Meet with me, I can put you in front of 150 people in a single day also from my town that have this if you wish, as well as over 15 doctors here that are treating us now that agree that we are not crazy. You need to get another less destructive hobby, as you are helping to destroy peoples lives that might otherwise find help. You are a disgrace, or just be a man and take my up on my challenge if you dare, otherwise you are a fraud, in any case we that come here on occasion know you are a fraud. Take your best shot.
James, who says you are delusional? The only people who can make that call are your doctors. Has a doctor ever said you were delusional? Why did they say that?
http://www.fbodaily.com/archive/2007/07-July/16-Jul-2007/FBO-01342706.htm
FBO DAILY ISSUE OF JULY 16, 2007 FBO #2058
SOLICITATION NOTICE
B — Investigation of an Unexplained Dermopathy, California
Notice Date
7/14/2007
Notice Type
Solicitation Notice
NAICS
621498 — All Other Outpatient Care Centers
Contracting Office
Department of Health and Human Services, Center for Disease Control and Prevention, Procurement and Grants Office (Atlanta), 2920 Brandywine Road, Room 3000, Atlanta, GA, 30341-4146, UNITED STATES
ZIP Code
00000
Solicitation Number
Reference-Number-2007-Morgellons
Response Due
7/30/2007
Archive Date
8/14/2007
Description
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), Coordinating Center for Infectious Diseases (CCID), National Center for Preparedness, Detection, and Control of Infectious Diseases (NCPDCID), Division of Healthcare Quality Promotion is seeking to award a sole source commercial contract for investigation in California of an unexplained dermopathy (Skin Condition)called Morgellons. The Government has determined that Kaiser Permanente (KP), Northern California is the only responsible source to meet the Government’s needs. Morgellons is a rare condition with a heavy concentration in California, and KP is the only organization that has the location, coverage area, and membership size to provide the large sample size required for the study. Minimum HMO membership required to satisfy this study is %25 of the population in the region selected. Other minimum vendor qualifications for this requirement are: Electronic health records that have been implemented in the organization at least since January 2006; Ability to conduct electronic queries of medical records, including progress notes, to identify clinical conditions and complaints; Health maintenance organization with at least 3 million enrollees and coverage of at least 25% of the population in the chosen geographic area; Location in a geographic area with a large number of suspected cases; Experience in conducting clinical and epidemiologic studies; Adequate qualified personnel to successfully perform the requested services by the date required. The proposed effort will involve the following: describing the clinical and epidemiologic features of persons who have reported themselves as having this unexplained skin condition, including assessing the frequency of co-morbid conditions (e.g., neurocognitive deficits, neurologic conditions, major psychiatric disorders); collecting information to generate hypotheses about possible risk factors for this condition; assessing the histopathologic features of the skin condition based on skin biopsies from a sample of affected patients; characterizing fibers or threads obtained from patients with the condition to determine their potential etiology; describing the geographic distribution and estimate rates of illness; and describing health care utilization among persons with the condition. Total period of performance will be seven (7) months from date of award. The Government intends to issue a Request for Quotation (RFQ) on 31 July 2007, with award anticipated by 31 August 2007. All responsible sources may submit a bid, proposal, or quotation which shall be considered by the agency.
James,
You see..they don’t even know what the people in charge of this site are saying..another tactic to make you go crazy with how stupid someone can be. I will also offer money to anyone who can prove I am wrong but also expect to be paid if I a right. They need to put up or shut up.
Randy
Tall Cotton Says:
Randy, Fred asked me to explain my comment, and I did. You’re right, thirty-five plus years ago, meningitis wasn’t as common. I didn’t, and I don’t, know the full particulars, as to why the teams of doctors didn’t know what that baby and what the girl from school had.
James, Randy, and anyone else who wants to prove something to a perfect stranger so badly that you’re offering visits to your home, and money…
Please, just stop that!!!
Beverly,
Prior to any further communication from people suffering from this heretofore unnamed illness, I need clarification as to Kaiser’s interest as an HMO. Your financial interests would be negatively compromised by identification and recognition of a new disease with potentially thousands of claimants barring any existing drug protocol to identify a diseases and to therefore legitimize the disease would enormously impact your bottom line.
I would understand a pharmaceutical company’s investigation because such an inquiry could lead to a pharmacological remedy and the concomitant revenue. Given the fact that insurance coverage for this disease would increase why is Kaiser being considered?
Randy B Yaskal
——-Original Message——-
From: Beverly.Hayon@kp.org
Date: 7/23/2007 7:08:57 PM
To: cisfl2004@netzero.com
Subject: Re: Is this true? Morgellons
According to the Director of our Division of Research:
“We are in discussion with CDC about such a study. The contract hasn’t been signed yet, but it’s being planned as a sole source contract. Hence the need to publish in fed BizOpps register like this.”
That is all we can say at this time, but certainly a hopeful development.
Beverly Hayon
Brand Strategy, Communications and Public Relations
Kaiser Permanente
B — Investigation of an Unexplained Dermopathy, California
Notice Date
7/14/2007
Notice Type
Solicitation Notice
NAICS
621498 — All Other Outpatient Care Centers
Contracting Office
Department of Health and Human Services, Center for Disease Control and Prevention, Procurement and Grants Office (Atlanta), 2920 Brandywine Road, Room 3000, Atlanta, GA, 30341-4146, UNITED STATES
ZIP Code
00000
Solicitation Number
Reference-Number-2007-Morgellons
Response Due
7/30/2007
Archive Date
8/14/2007
Description
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), Coordinating Center for Infectious Diseases (CCID), National Center for Preparedness, Detection, and Control of Infectious Diseases (NCPDCID), Division of Healthcare Quality Promotion is seeking to award a sole source commercial contract for investigation in California of an unexplained dermopathy (Skin Condition)called Morgellons. The Government has determined that Kaiser Permanente (KP), Northern California is the only responsible source to meet the Government’s needs. Morgellons is a rare condition with a heavy concentration in California, and KP is the only organization that has the location, coverage area, and membership size to provide the large sample size required for the study. Minimum HMO membership required to satisfy this study is %25 of the population in the region selected. Other minimum vendor qualifications for this requirement are: Electronic health records that have been implemented in the organization at least since January 2006; Ability to conduct electronic queries of medical records, including progress notes, to identify clinical conditions and complaints; Health maintenance organization with at least 3 million enrollees and coverage of at least 25% of the population in the chosen geographic area; Location in a geographic area with a large number of suspected cases; Experience in conducting clinical and epidemiologic studies; Adequate qualified personnel to successfully perform the requested services by the date required. The proposed effort will involve the following: describing the clinical and epidemiologic features of persons who have reported themselves as having this unexplained skin condition, including assessing the frequency of co-morbid conditions (e.g., neurocognitive deficits, neurologic conditions, major psychiatric disorders); collecting information to generate hypotheses about possible risk factors for this condition; assessing the histopathologic features of the skin condition based on skin biopsies from a sample of affected patients; characterizing fibers or threads obtained from patients with the condition to determine their potential etiology; describing the geographic distribution and estimate rates of illness; and describing health care utilization among persons with the condition. Total period of performance will be seven (7) months from date of award. The Government intends to issue a Request for Quotation (RFQ) on 31 July 2007, with award anticipated by 31 August 2007. All responsible sources may submit a bid, proposal, or quotation which shall be considered by the agency.
Record
SN01342706-W 20070716/070714220302 (fbodaily.com)
Source
FedBizOpps Link to This Notice
(may not be valid after Archive Date)
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EDI VAN Interconnect
We offer money and are not afraid of people coming to our homes because this disease is bigger than any individual and we re wiling to sacrifice ourselves for the greater good. That is how serious this is. We can prove it and are willing to and we will put out money where our mouths are becuase we know we will not be proven wrong. That is how real this is. We can prove it and are willing to with money, time and our privacy. Our you willing to , to prove it is not real..of course not.
Randy, there are legitimate reasons why “morgellons disease” patients have similarities that have led them into thinking that they all have one new thing. It’s very understandable how most of you arrived at this conclusion, and have been taken by this, and how you’re being used. It seems that most of you even want to be used, but I guess that’s just part of how it goes, when patients can’t trust their doctors’ diagnoses, and follow their treatment. I think I could provide some good proof to you, if the confidential registration for “morgellons disease” forms, from the MRF and OSU, were accessible to the public.
For example, consider the patients with Parkinsons, or ALS, since it was recently mentioned in the below article.
http://psychologytoday.com/articles/index.php?term=pto-20070227-000003&page
“Morgellons disease” is about a whole lot more than skin issues, and, in my opinion, “morgellons’ doctors/researchers” are blatantly preying upon some of our world’s most ill patients. They have knowledge of what genuine conditions have contributed into so many patients having developed the state of psychosis known as DOP. That state has led to self-poisonings in a lot of people, too, which could also, possibly, account for so many patients displaying such a similar “look”.
But, okay, Randy, just try to consider pretending that I was in need of some easy money, and, so, I decided to come to see you, agree with what you said, and I took your money, and left. Do you understand what I mean? That wouldn’t help you. Can you define what you think DOP is?
You are illogical and rather childish and immature in your thought procceses. First, you would leave without the money you came with. No one here is being used by anyone. This clearly shows how YOU think and how you do not trust yourself from being used by others. It is clearly a projection of your self worth or lack of it. I suggest you get counceling to secure your fear of being used and not being able to keep up with those you think are trying to use you. This is clearly paranoid thought. I and those that have this, do not fall into the category that you fall into and the biggest and saddest day was the day that you believed that you were a person who had this disease and decided to talk about it when you clearly did not have it. That is your personal problem and it should have never been allowed to have a forum where you could upset those that are sick and the owner of this forum is guilty for allowing that sin to happen. Seek counseing for your fear of being used ad stop projecting it onto this forum.
I’m real sorry you feel the ways you do, Randy.
Randy,
According to the MRF, the vast majority of Morgellons patients have been diagnosed multiple times by multiple doctors with Delusions of Parasitosis. The vast majority of Morgellons patients that post on the believers forums demonstrate the fact that they are psychotic. Although several Morgellons patients have revealed physical illnesses with which they have been diagnosed, it’s obvious that the only illness that is shared by the vast majority of patients is their delusional mental state. If everyone with mental illnesses were eliminated from the study, there wouldn’t be anyone left.
Tall Cotton
You are just a horrible person without a soul. May you have a disease or syndrome that causes you to lose your job, your looks, finds you bedridden with non-healing skin lesions afraid to hug your children or go out in public and no one will believe you and you can not get medical help and then you have an A hole site with A-hole people who are to scared to even meet with a real person that has this but will talk out their A hole and see if you don’t crack up! Good luck. You have no soul. I feel really bad for you.
Well stop feeling bad for anyone, but yourself, from here on out, Randy.
Wow Michael, this post was really interesting, thanks.
And you’re right, someone saying they have Morgue-ellons might distract doctors from the real problem. But I think a lot of doctors know how to deal with people’s printouts of stuff off the net nowadays, and self-diagnosing etc, and actually will just look at the symptoms people present. I’ve heard of them doing this in similar cases. A general practitioner is not a shrink and unless someone obviously acts like a fruit-loop, will just focus on the symptoms people really have. People are misled by health info on the net or telly all the time.
The parasite that is the cause of this disease is known. I was poisoned and got sores with strands. I went from fit to seriously ill. This parasite is known. These families suffering have been singled out by some sick people.
My heart breaks to read mothers, fathers and all children have this. This is a holocausting of precious families. I have read of two people dieing and one suicide.
GO TO: http://WWW.POISONTORTUREDINUSA.COM
Families need to know the truth. Poisoned caused this. Parents with it having children and babies get it. I know of some monsters in one apartment complex in Georgia. I know one small town that covered up a crime. Today, that crime is on http://www.poisontorturedinusa.com.
I have written to http://www.morgellons.org, the news media and Dr Wymore. It is time for the truth. Somebody is delivering poison. I am a living witness with the evidence on the worldwide web.
I hope hearts can heal, after reading. I hope sores will heal, after reading. You have to read it. You have to share information. We have to save families, together. Help me to save families with just a little truth.
I work and and work hard I sleep and sleep well now 95% of the time. You have to read my story. Let’s save families. Let’s put smiles on children’s faces. I live with the disease and the truth of poison is for the world to read.
poisontorturedinusa
I have a couple of medical conditions that not so long ago were generally labeled as “all in the head”. Now time has passed, decades, and data has been collected, the conditions have been validated. I hesitate to argue or deny anyone’s personal reality until I have examined it up close and in detail over time. I know first hand what it is like to have a peculiar set of symptoms that baffle the docs only to have them label me as a head case because they themselves are unable to figure it out. Thank heaven for baby docs, who had the drive to get to the bottom of it all.
Web Jones, I think the different thing with this condition is that it has examinable signs – the fibers. If 10,000 people have been producing fibers from their skin for the last five years, then how is it conceivably possible that nobody has examined the fibers?
The answer is: they have examined them. Time and again, dermatologists and doctors have examined the fibers people say they found emerging from their skin, and they have been shown to be nothing but lint and hair. This happens thousands of times. Fibers are even set off to labs, and the results came back as wool or cotton.
The CDC study will provide more definitive answers, but until it does, people should not be claiming that there is a new disease, and should give each individual the particular health care that they need, without making broad assumptions.