nosology \nō-ˈsä-lə-jē, -ˈzä-\ noun, probably from New Latin nosologia, from Greek nosos disease + New Latin –logia –logy. circa 1721
1 : a classification or list of diseases
2 : a branch of medical science that deals with classification of diseases
In any discussion, particularly in science, the defining of terms is vital to progress. If you think a term means one thing, and someone else thinks it means something else, then unless you address this difference, you are not going to come to any meaningful agreement.
This problem is particularly apparent in the phenomenon of “Morgellons“. There are two particular terms that cause problems. The first is, obviously, “Morgellons” itself, and the second is “Delusional Parasitosis” (DP). The confusion between these terms has led to the doubly misunderstood (and hence incorrect) statement that “Morgellons is DP”. Morgellons is not DP.
For a doctor, “Morgellons” is a list of symptoms. Itching, lesions, finding fibers, fatigue, confusion and a few others. It’s a rather broad list, and various people define it slightly differently, and the extent to which you have to have all the symptoms varies. Stricker and Savely say you can have Morgellons without finding fibers. Most doctors don’t think that this list of symptoms really defines a new disease, and the conditions of people who self-diagnose with Morgellons is rather better explained by existing diseases.
For the patient however, “Morgellons” is “the disease that is causing my problems”. So if they hear someone say “Morgellons is not real”, it’s like someone said “your problems are not real”. The patient will quite understandably get very angry when someone tells them that their problems are not real, because their problems ARE real.
This is compounded when people talk about DP. The definition of DP will vary based on who you ask. Some people say that if there is a physical condition underlying your false belief in parasites, then that’s NOT DP. DP, they will say, is present when:
The patients have no obvious cognitive impairment, and abnormal organic factors are absent. True infestations and primary systemic diseases that cause pruritus are not involved. Primary skin lesions are not present.
In other words, if the patient has something wrong with them, such as diabetes, or if their formication is caused by a physical condition such as menopause, then they can’t have DP. If they have obvious cognitive impairment, then they can’t have DP either. If they have a skin condition like eczema, or folliculitis, then they can’t have DP.
This restrictive definition of DP allows proponents of Morgellons to say not only that “Morgellons is not DP”, but “people with Morgellons cannot have DP”, since DP is a purely psychiatric condition with one mental symptom, and Morgellons includes both additional physical symptoms (fatigue, tooth loss, etc) , and additional mental symptoms (brain fog, confusion, etc.)
The problem here is not with the Morgellons community, they are actually using definitions of DP to come up with a logically consistent conclusion. The problem here is with the dermatology community for both their broad statements like: “Morgellons is DP” and their simultaneously conflicting statements like: “DP is a single symptom mental illness”. Neither of these statement is correct.
The reality is that Morgellons is a list of symptoms of unknown statistical significance, and DP is the unshakable false belief that one is infested by parasites, and comes in primary, secondary functional, and secondary organic forms.
Dermatologists, of course, appreciate the complexity of the situation, but they do not seem to be communicating it very well. They would make their jobs a lot easier if they made a little effort to communicate these distinctions, both to their patients, and to the media.
In my opinion, it doesn’t really matter whether or not the Morgies have Delusional Parasitosis, or whether they are delusional about everything but parasites. It’s totally obvious that the Morgies are delusional. It seems as if almost all of their beliefs are delusional. They suffer from a garden variety of physical disorders, but most of Morgies that post on the believer’s forums clearly have mental problems. The problem is that the Morgies think they’ve got it together, that they are “chosen”, and that it’s their duty to educate the people who have sound minds, beginning with their doctors. They need to shut up and listen, and follow their doctor’s recommendations. In my opinion they should also stay away from quacks like Stricker and Savely.
TC, it’s temping to generalize, and easy too. But you can’t just say things like “the Morgies … think they are ‘chosen’“, and expect anything good to come of it. Sure, a few have said they were ‘chosen’ (including members of the MRF), but you can’t extrapolate that to the general population.
Generalizations are simplifications, and can lead to problems of communication. Sure, there are a lot of mental problems out there, but you don’t want to prejudge anyone.
I really feel for dermatologists being faced with issues that far exceed being skin deep. From all I’ve been gathering, when a DOP diagnosis is given, and patients are referred to mental health professionals, they are not exactly telling it to them like it is. That is, “if” they even go (and such patients usually appear to get offended, and don’t go). Being medical doctors, the mental health professional would do for the patient what the patient wants, and needs…medical tests to locate the underlying illness that has made them so ill. Whether they’re DOP, or not, would be resolved, there, and treated (if the patient could accept treatment), as well as any referrals to other medical specialists would be made, right there, for the patient.
The patients in the “morgellons disease” movement just don’t seem able to want to get well, or, maybe, it’s as I firmly believe, many need to have medical powers of attorneys assigned to assist them. They are all too complicated to understand, each, in their own ways. But, there are also those with munchausen syndrome, who keep on experimenting,
…and the list of the many types of “morgellons disease” patients goes on and on, and on, and on.
Hey, on another un-related, yet, related, topic… I didn’t even know, until recently, that the CEO of Igenex Lab is on the board of the ILADS. It seems that I once may have posted a link to this, or something very similar, and I may have read about him before, but I sure didn’t grasp it, if I did!!! (This is what my opinion is, of real horror stories and conspiracy.)
Health
Lyme Inc.
David Whelan 03.12.07
http://www.aldf.com/pdf/LymeInc.pdf
I know that there are exceptions to almost every rule, but let’s not be naive, Morgies aren’t typical people. There’s no way to help a Morgie until they decide to get honest, and open their minds to the fact that they are delusional.
Now, now. Delusional disorders just don’t work that way, TC. DOP, yes, can be treated, if the patient isn’t lost to follow-up, but not all “morgellons disease patients” even have DOP. They seem to, but I think they’re just the ones who started this awareness.
When, and how, does someone realize they’re delusional? Look at how many patients who say they have “morgellons disease” have been involuntarily committed and can not comply with treatment after release. Whatever all of the various disorders making up what they call “morgellons disease” are, none of the people online who claim to have it have a sense of themselves, or any insight into what is the matter with them.
There are some who say they’re happy that the schizophrenic, OCD, or bi-polar mania types are “researching”, feeling that they’re way above their heads with all their wild theories, and seem subdued in their online demeanor. Some of these people may just be vulnerably gullible. But, on the whole, most of the patients appear convinced that they are going to enlighten the world with their newfound knowledge.
I don’t think they want to consider that they live in a state of delusions, and schizophrenic and bi-polar delusions are often not treatable, through medication, or counseling. Oh, cognitive therapy can help their states of mind, but I think this group of patients are in too deep with this movement to do anything except what they’re doing. The behavioral disorders abound, too. I think thyroid, diabetes, atherosclerosis, liver and kidney disease, is prevalent among them, as well.
To get well, one has to know what their problem is, first, and these patients are all deceived. By whom? By the patients who are in the worst need of help and don’t have any insight into it, calling it what a woman with munchausen syndrome by proxy named all of it.
Smack!!! Hehehe, got me wound up, huh? Sorry.
It’s not really about Delusional Parasitosis. It’s about delusions in general. Most of the Morgies have obviously lost touch with reality. They think they are going to convince the world that Morgellons is a disease. They think that there’s a conspiracy to spread an infectious disease. They think that their doctors are guilty of malpractice. They think that they are going to sue someone and get rich. These are all delusions. And whether these people come to their senses by the Grace of God, or whether it comes about through antipsychotic medication or some other means, if they are to be well, they must come to their senses. And delusional disorders are just one of their mental problems. There are many others that are hard at work in the Morgellons community. Wellness will only come as truth penetrates the darkness.
http://zeitgeistmovie.com/
All just part of the plan…..this site, the disease, your denial of it…..all just part of a plan
Beth Burke, I’m not sure what your message is, but cultivating fear consumes those who are susceptible, and everyone’s aware that some people can’t help it. The dark side may be all that some “morgellons disease patients” have ever known, too, and it grieves many people to consider that. But, so many have lost their way, as well, speaking of once having another life that they just want to get back, but they don’t know how. Many, sadly, even quote scripture as though it’s supposed to do something.
Darkness is not easily escapable, but it’s impossible to get out of when that’s all a person chooses to allow themselves to keep dwelling on, and they can’t tell when someone who really cares about them has valid reasons for being concerned. Lots of “morgellons disease patients” even seem to know that fact, yet, appear totally unable to refrain from canceling out trying to replace their bad thoughts with better ones, as soon as they acknowledge it. They don’t know what’s causing that, apparently. There is a reverse side to everything, and the world seems flipped over backwards to a lot of these patients, because “the world of morgellons disease” IS all backwards, mangled, twisted up, and confused.
There is help for every individual, one way, or another, but not when guards are up, as well as there being quite a few other patients pulling each other back into the darkness, and holding them there (which is so good for the “doctors” and “researchers” of “morgellons disease”, sitting at the helm of this terrible thing, acting like they’re going to rescue everyone). Of course, those who can’t realize this is what’s occurring (as it’s happening to so many), need rescued in the worst way.
I don’t see a way out for a lot of people involved in this, as it seems to grow and spread like the End Time plague they say it is.
did somebody just whup Michael upside the head with a reasonability stick? i’m almost impressed…
w/r/t to one of the posters above posting the usual garbage put out
by the ALDF… which is basically the quackwatch-allied arm of
the IDSA, gone-a-huntin for lyme doctors that are causing the HMO&insurance spreadsheets to not add up right with their crazytalk of “treat until signs and symptoms of the disease are gone” and “don’t ignore the other 9,000 articles of reasearch that didn’t agree with your coverup of your bioweapon complicity”). I’d say they’re like morgellonswatch, except that they’re “pro’s’ at it, and you’re amateurs.
here’s what http://lyme.kaiserpapers.info says about the ALDF
“American Lyme Disease Foundation. The ALDF is essentially an arm of those relative few who have controlled Lyme disease information for decades. This includes some of the authors of the IDSA Lyme
disease guidelines. The ALDF also has ties to the CDC and vice-versa. The ALDF was formed by James Connolly of Castle & Connolly, an HMO advocate. The ALDF and its members have profit interests
in Lyme disease.”
If you had worms or worm-like creatures crawling out of your skin that someone with you could see and that showed up in a picture, would you be crazy? It’s easy to call someone else delusional when you are not the one it happens to. You people that label Morgellons sufferers delusional are speaking out of ignorance. Have you examined any specimens from these people’s skin under a microscope? Have you seen the worms coming out of their skin? If not, why do you form an opinion about something you’ve never seen or studied? If you believe that there is such a thing as lice, which are parasites that fasten onto a person’s skin, why can’t you believe that there are worms that do the same thing? It’s a known fact that in India and Africa, there are all different kinds of parasites, many of them worms. There are medical books filled with information about a wide variety of parasites. Elephantosis is a parasitic disease and it makes people’s limbs swell up out of proportion. No one calls victims of elephantosis delusional. You might change your tune if Morgellons happened to you. At least Stricker and Savely are making an effort to take the time to find out what is really going on, which is more than I can say for some of you people on this website. What about the people whose skin has cleared up when these doctors treat them with anti-parasitic medicine? Analyzing a person’s emotions isn’t going to kill parasites and neither is bigotry. Have you ever actually met a person who suffers from Morgellons? If not, how can you say what they do or don’t know? These people come from every walk of life and many of them are intelligent, successful, professional people who have suffered greatly because of this condition. Do you really believe that there would be that many people who suddenly became delusional?
Hi Anyone,
I see a few things that make my eyebrow raise in your comment above. First, if you have worms coming out of your skin, what has your physician said when they saw it? Second, suggesting someone is suffering from a delusional disorder is NO laughing matter and is not something said as name-calling or belittling, rather, as a serious concern, and does not mean that some people don’t have legitimate skin conditions. It just means that people are mistaken about the causation of their suffering, and unshakable in that belief. Third, worms coming out of your skin is not what “all” Morgellons sufferers claim, so I further question the definition and identification of this alleged condition. Fourth, people from every walk of life can suffer from a mental health condition, and that doesn’t mean they are weak or stupid, but it just shows that everyone is susceptible— look at Dr. Jay Traver, for example. Last, that “so many people” are “suddenly delusional” is an argument from the mass, meaning that just because a lot of people believe something doesn’t make it true or not.
Rather than arguing with the people who are skeptical of Morgellons, perhaps you could provide evidence? A video, perhaps, of the worms coming out of your skin, or suggest how Morgellons could not be better explained by other conditions, and what makes it unique and requiring a new diagnosis?
I hope that we can discuss further your experience and come to a mutual understanding.
Anyone U.S.A., are you able to explain why you’ve jumped to the conclusions you have about everyone who’s skeptical of “morgellons disease”? Mercy sakes alive, YOU, I’ve been a victim of DOP before, without a microscope, and without a doctor’s diagnosis. You aren’t barking up MY tree.
anyoneUSA,
Yes, I’ve personally examined many “Morgellons” specimens. I’ve also studied many photographs. In fact, I used to be a “Morgie”. I was certain that I had parasites, and from my observations I was quite convinced that these parasites were very strange. It took me three years to realize that most of what I had observed were hallucinations and delusions. After that, it took another year to realize that some of my most unshakable beliefs were also false. My head was really screwed up, and it took a long time to get it straightened out.
During my illness I removed dozens of objects from my skin that appeared to be worms. For years I believed that this is what the objects were, but they were not. They were not organisms, period, but while I was sick with what people call Morgellons, they sure looked like living worms. I had a lot of other misunderstandings. My false beliefs were compounded with misunderstanding upon misunderstanding. And I was a member of the Morgellons forums and was a registrant at the MRF. I’m speaking out of experience, not ignorance, as you suggest.
Delusions of Parasitosis is not an accusation. It’s not a label. It’s a diagnosis. One survey revealed that most of the people who believed they had Morgellons had been diagnosed with DOP by 10 to 40 doctors each. Those doctors were qualified professionals, and after studying the behavior and beliefs of many “Morgies”, I’ve come to my own conclusion that those doctors’ diagnoses are correct.
There are lots of parasites in this world, but this isn’t India or Africa, and parasitical infections is not what most of the “Morgies” are suffering from. In my opinion, Stricker and Savely know exactly what is going on, and they are exploiting their patients for everything they can get. You said that “Analyzing a person’s emotions isn’t going to kill parasites”. This may be true, but treating one’s mental illness should put an end to one’s false belief that they are infected by parasites. Many of the “Morgies” have one or more physical illness, but most of them also believe that they are sick because of parasites, and in almost every case, this belief is false.
There is no such thing as Morgellons, but many are suffering from other illnesses and because of their belief in Morgellons. This belief and its obsessions has brought ruin to many families. It has caused several parents to abuse, and lose, their children. Because of this false belief, many have divorced and have been ruined financially. And, no, it’s not hard to believe that this many people have suddenly become delusional. Nor has it anything to do with one’s profession or how intelligent they are. But when the belief in Morgellons begins, the success story ends.
tallcotton
This belief and its obsessions has brought ruin to many families. It has caused several parents to abuse, and lose, their children
eXTRA FUX YOU STUPID MF
Please try to understand that these things are all publicized and discussed by “morgellons disease patients”. Certainly, as a patient, you really can’t have expected that alerting the public’s attention to this situation should have led to it all being swept underneath the rug.
tallcotton,
Thank you for being honest and sharing your experience. I have some questions for you. Did you look at what came out of your skin under a microscope or just with the naked eye? Did you treat it? If so, what kind of results did you get? What comes out of your skin now? And who convinced you that what you saw wasn’t an organism? Did you come to this conclusion by yourself, or did someone else who didn’t believe in Morgellons convince you? If it was someone else, was this a person who had thoroughly studied Morgellons objectively? Maybe the reason the things coming out of your skin looked like worms is because they were worms. Parasites can happen anywhere. Just because we are in America doesn’t mean we are immune to them. They can be transported by people coming in or pets, or birds that migrate here from South America or Mexico. It’s also possible that something mutated. We need to look at what comes out of people’s skin to see what it is, not at what they believe or how they behave.
I disagree with you about Stricker and Savely. Did you go to them for help before concluding that Morgellons wasn’t real? I believe that Stricker and Savely are sincere and approaching the subject objectively. I think there is a parasite out there and we owe it to the people who are suffering with it to investigate it and find out exactly what it is and what its characteristics are so that we can give them relief and keep it from spreading because it is contagious. We don’t know what its long-term effects are or whether or not it could harm vital organs.
sarahbionedunn,
There are videos all over the internet of these parasites. One lady has already shown a video of worms crawling out of her skin. There is also a video of a man that shows them coming out of his skin. Do the skeptics look at this evidence objectively? No. They look at it with the idea that it is something that they must explain away and make fit what they already believe. The evidence is there. If they’re not looking at it objectively, what good will it do for someone else to present more evidence?
I’ve never heard of Dr. Jay Traver. I’ll have to look his name up and find out what happened to him. I agree with you about one thing– just because a large number of people believe something doesn’t mean that it is or isn’t true. But– DOP is a very rare disease. It isn’t likely that so many people in so many walks of life that don’t know about each other would suddenly become so seriously delusional at the same time with the same or similar thing. To me, this is an indication that there really is some kind of parasite there. It isn’t likely that these people have influenced each other by hysteria or a fad when Morgellons is not a widely known disease and most of these people do not know each other, nor have they heard of this disease. The testimonies that I’ve seen on the internet are from people who have experienced the symptoms and were looking for an answer before they found something that looked like what they had. They did not appear to be influenced into believing they had symptoms by someone else who was seeing delusions. These were people who were in touch with reality and the world around them. Parasitic diseases are not something that people want to have. They are not a fad that everyone wants to participate in like seeing UFOs. They carry a stigma that people do not want to experience. Most people want to explain them away before acknowledging that they have them.
Smileykins,
Just because you had DOP doesn’t mean Morgellons is not a parasite. If your DOP was from drugs, that would be a whole different matter. Why have you jumped to conclusions about everyone who has Morgellons? Explain that.
SmellyCotton,
If you want to call people names, you should refrain from using obscenities. It doesn’t get your point across and it does not make you look smart. It makes a lot of people think less of you. Be a little more resourceful and think of something a little more original, more witty, and less obscene and that contributes intelligently to the conversation. You might find out that you have a brain and a valid opinion and are able to engage in a conversation and relate politely to people who disagree with you.
Who do you know that abused and lost their children because of Morgellons? What kind of proof do you have that this condition is not caused by a parasite? Abuse and a broken up family isn’t proof of what Morgellons is whether or not it’s the reason for such a tragedy.
Smileykins and tallcotton you both need to leve the Morgies alone and please try just alittle harder to get a life, just why do you care so much, It Is like you both have something to gain from putting us down, please just leave us all alone, and again please find a life.
Yes It Is me again dear tallcotton and smileykins you two really need to get the hell off all the morgie people that Is out there trying their best to try to understand just what the hell Is going on, but I do promise you both that all hell will soon hit the fan because this that Is Indeed going on with us can’t and won’t be covered up to much longer. I for one don’t do any drugs except the ones that my doctor has me on to help my pain due to major low back surgery, I just had a big durg screen done on me because I needed to find a new doctor because the pain clinic that I was going to has closed down. I am not one to sit by and let people like you mess up what us morgies have and need to try to find some kind of others In the same condiction as us to relate with, we really don’t need what you two have to offer. Please just leave us alone, It Is so clear to me and others that both of you are just full of wind, get the hell out of our lives you really don’t belong here. Like I said before the truth will come out soon and there Is not a thing you two will ever be able to do to stop It, just remember there Is alot of us out here that will never let this go, how could we. If you think for one minute that I wish to have all the sores that I have on my body for one minute you both are so wrong, I am a lady and I do realize that after being with a man for over nine years now, and It was ended only because this guy could not handle the sores that has taken over my body, Now I do know that there Is not a man alive that will be able to be with me because of the sores and I can’t ever see myself with another man because I do not feel that I could feel good about what a man would think about the sores. So please just shut up and stay out of something that you both don’t belong In.
I am asking you both just please go away and leave us morgie people alone, because neither one of you will know at this point just what we are going threw. I would also like to add that just because you don’t have the sores does not meen that you don’t have Morgellons, there Is a reason why some of us have the sores and soon that will also be known. I do believe that most of the people In this world do have Morgellons, just take a dust test In your own home for every house that I go In It has shown up In, all you need to do Is take a good dust sample In your home and you will see all the odd fibers, they are white blue black and red, trust me you will see them just don’t dust for a week and test the rooms that you are In the most, they will be there waiting for you. So get the hell out of or lifes untill you truly see what Is In yours, you think that this Is a game well trust me you both will soon find out what we all ready know. Grab your ankles and kiss your ass good bye. Don’t blame me for speeking the truth we will all find out what hell Is really about………….. DOP to me only means, at this point In my life … Dont Offer Promises…. That you know nothing about……Connie
Hit me with your best shot, oh I do know that you both will, come on were waiting, you dumb asses. Oh thats right you do drugs all night and sleep all day, dam I guess my timing Is off. Please wake up, oh wait a minute PLEASE DON’T. Sielents Is Golden.
Get the hell out of lifes that you don’t belong In. I’m so sick of seeing the both of you every were that the Morgellons people are trying to find and just understand what the hell Is going on In our lifes. The only thing that we do realize Is that we don’t need people of your sort In our world. Just listen we did not ask for this to happen to us but It has and we need to try our best to get the help that we deserve. We DO NOT DESERVE THE LIKES OF YOU TWO, GET THE HELL OUT. There Is not a thing that you both could say at this point that would ever make a difference. GO AWAY PLEASE JUST GO GO GO AWAY. Why the both of you are trying so hard to Interfear I don’t understand just leave all of us alone and do something else, It Is like you are working for the goverment and getting something In return for what you are doing, Is that worth the problems that you are causing to people that you don’t know or understand. Please again GO AWAY. Soon you boyh will find out the truth, but oh wait I do belive at this point that you all ready know the truth for that Is the meens of your mission. My ownley wish and at this point I do believe that It Is alot of the Morgellons people wish Is you both just don’t wake up, for you both have to be on something that has blinded you from the truth that Is Indeed out there. Give It up and go home and leave the rest of us alone…………. People like the both of you have no place In this world, Please tell us all just what are you gaining from all this…… Check your own home before you stick your nose In to ours…………………..LOVE CONNIE
Connie, I’m sorry you are not well. You say:
I’m afraid that’s just what normal dust looks like. Those fibers are nothing special – just normal bits of clothing and paper. Did you read this?:
http://morgellonswatch.com/2006/04/11/fibers-are-everywhere/
It’s just dust, but that does not mean you are not ill, or that it’s all in your head. You should work with your doctor to find what treatment is best for you.
is there any morgies out there from australia,im desperate to speak to someone who knows what im going through…and has the same feed back from the variety of doctors and dermatoligists that i have seen
Hi, Donna. I imagine you can find some fellow aussies to share the effects and consequences of “morgellons disease”, pretty easily on some of the “morgellons disease” message boards.
Anyone U.S.A., in your first comment, you made a lot of emotion-driven statements and asked a whole lot of emotion-driven questions, causing one to have to look beyond them to decipher what you’re really saying. If you really want to try exchanging geniune communication and discussing what “morgellons disease” is, we can be fair and take turns in the order of who asked a question first, can we not?
Be forewarned, that I have admitted, and proven, that I am unaccustomed to the certain styles of persons possessed of “morgellons disease”. Nevertheless, I have tried to communicate with quite a few, in different ways. You are welcome to either read all of my comments on Morgellonswatch (which would be quite exhausting), or (just as exhausting), click onto the name “Smilkeykins” over my posts and see if you can understand, from reading on that site (as well as in its’ comments’ section) that I don’t jump to conclusions concerning what “morgellons disease” is. Most of my views on “morgellons disease” are clear and I’ve stated many times how I’ve arrived at them.
Connie needs a dousing of Holy water and a Cross. +
I’m sorry. I’m not accustomed to this, but Connie gives me that distinct impression. If you come back to this site, Connie, make me change my mind. I want evidence of where it is that you say TC and I are going, and what it is that we’re doing. Morgie folk have made Tallcotton, Michael, Sarah Bione-Dunn, me, and Jeezelouise (in the past), so many things, just because you all say so. Give me proof. Please? But, we can’t leave you alone if it’s all in your head.
Oh, TC explained that Connie probably means that she doesn’t want to see us on this blog. She wants us to get off of Morgellonswatch and the internet. I don’t know which scenario is worse…what I thought she meant, or what she means, but I’m sorry she is the way she is. Three-fold law, Connie. It’s tried and true.